>> GOOD MORNING.
2 I AM OPHELIA FALLS, THE DIRECTOR OF OUTREACH FOR THE
GENERAL SERVICES ADMINISTRATION, THE DIRECTOR OF THE
3 USDA TARGET CENTER AND THE CHAIRPERSON OF THE
INNER-AGENCY DISABILITY EDUCATIONAL AWARENESS
4 SHOWCASE, IDEAS.
WOULD YOU PLEASE RISE FOR THE PRESENTATIONS OF THE
5 COLORS AND REMAIN STANDING UNTIL THE COLORS RETREAT.
>> I PLEDGE ALIEGENCE TO THE FLAG, OF THE
6 UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.
AND TO THE REPUBLIC REPUBLIC TO WHICH IT STANDS, ONE
7 NATION, UNDER GOD, WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL.
WE WILL NOW HAVE A SOLO.
8 PLEASE JOIN SARITA DAVIS IN GOD BLESS AMERICA.
>> GOOD BLESS AMERICA, LAND THAT I LOVE.
9 STAND BESIDE HER AND GUIDE HER THROUGH THE NIGHT WITH
A LIGHT FROM ABOVE.
10 FROM THE MOUNTAIN TO THE PRAIRIE TO THE OCEAN WHITE
WITH FOAM, GOD BLESS AMERICA MY HOME SWEET HOME.
11 THANK YOU.
>> RIGHT SHOULDER.
12 RIGHT, LEFT...
>> YOU MAY BE SEATED.
13 THANK YOU.
>> GOOD MORNING.
14 MY NAME IS MARTY WAGNER.
I'M THE ADMINISTRATOR FOR GOVERNMENT WIDE POLICY AT
15 GENERAL SERVICE ADMINISTRATION WHICH MEANS I WORRY A
LOT ABOUT HOW THE GOVERNMENT MANAGES ITSELF WHICH
16 INCLUDES A LARGE NUMBER OF DIFFERENT ACTIVITIES
INCLUDING THINGS LIKE ENSURING THAT WE MANAGE AN
17 EFFECTIVE WAY THAT DEALS WITH ISSUES OF DISABILITIES
AS WELL.
18 AND I REALLY HAPPY TO BE ABLE TO WELCOME YOU ON THIS
GEORGIOUS DISTRICT ATTORNEY DAY, ALTHOUGH I'M AFRAID
19 NONE OF US CAN SEE IT BECAUSE WE'RE ABOUT TWO DAYS
DOWN, BUT IT REALLY IS NICE.
20 THAT DOESN'T MEAN YOU SHOULD LEAVE; YOU SHOULD STICK
AROUND BUT STILL APPRECIATE IT'S A NIGHT DAY.
21 I WOULD LIKE TO BEGIN BY THANKING SARITA DAVIS FOR
THAT WONDERFUL RENDITION FOR.
22 IT SHOWS THAT THOSE OF US WORKING FOR THE FEDERAL
GOVERNMENT HAVE MANY TALENTS OTHER THAN GOVERNMENT.
23 IDEAS IS A 14 YEAR FEDERAL CONFERENCE HIGHLIGHTING
WAYS TO MAKE OUR INFORMATION ENVIRONMENTS ACCESSIBLE
24 TO ALL PEOPLE INCLUDING PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES.
WE ARRANGED IT AT GSA, BUT WE DIDN'T ARRANGE IT
25 ALONE.
THE GSA FOLKS WERE PRIMARILY UNDER TERRY WEAVER AND

2

1 THE CENTER FOR IT ACCOMMODATION.
I'D CERTAINLY LIKE TO THANK TERRY AND OPHELIA FALLS
2 WHO IS ON DETAIL TO US FROM AGRICULTURE BUT WE DO
APPRECIATE HER WORK AS WELL.
3 WE HAVE A CHANGE IN THE PROGRAM.
BECAUSE OF HEARINGS DEALING WITH FEMA ACTIVITIES, WE
4 HAVE A DIFFERENT SPEAKER.
TODAY WE'RE HONORED TO HAVE MS. JENNIFER CHILDS SHE
5 HE.
SHE'S A POLICY ADVISOR ON THE WHITE HOUSE DOMESTIC
6 POLICY COUNCIL.
SHE COORDINATES THE PRESIDENT'S NEW FREEDOM
7 INITIATIVE.
BEFORE THAT SHE WAS A SENIOR POLICY ADVISOR FOR THE
8 PRESIDENTIAL TASK FORCE FOR THE EMPLOYMENT OF ADULTS
WITH DISABILITIES.
9 SHE CAME TO THE TASK FORCE IN THE NATIONAL
ORGANIZATION ON DISABILITY WHERE SHE SERVED AS VICE
10 PRESIDENT AND DIRECTOR OF ITS CEO COUNCIL WORKING TO
INCREASE PRIVATE SECTOR EMPLOYMENT FOR PEOPLE WITH
11 DISABILITIES. PRIOR TO THAT SHE SERVED ON THE
DISABILITY BOARD OF DIRECTORS.
12 PLEASE WELCOME ME IN WELCOMING MS. JENNIFER CHILDS
SHEAHY PLEASE.
13 (APPLAUSE)
>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
14 I'M SURE ALL OF YOU WHO LOOKED AT YOUR SCHEDULE SAW
THAT SENATOR JEFFORDS WAS SPEAKING AND THEN SAW ME.
15 WORRIED A LITTLE BIT, BUT I WANT TO ASSURE YOU AND
SENATOR JEFFORDS, HE MADE ONE BIG CHANGE, BUT HE DID
16 NOT MAKE ANOTHER BIG CHANGE.
(LAUGHTER) I WANT TO TELL YOU A LITTLE
17 STORY ABOUT MYSELF AND HOW I GOT INVOLVED IN THIS.
SEVEN YEARS AGO I FELT I WAS ON TOP OF THE WORLD.
18 I HAD JUST STARTED BUSINESS SCHOOL, I WAS DRIVING A
CUTE LITTLE CONVERTIBLE, I PLAYED GOLF EVERY FREE
19 MINUTE THEY HAD AND THE ONLY HANDICAP THEY HAD EVER
HEARD OF OR KNEW ABOUT WAS MY PUTTING STROKE.
20 I WAS INTERNING THAT SUMMER FOR ANHEUSER BUSCH AND
DOING THAT I THOUGHT AT THE TIME EVERY PATRIOTIC
21 AMERICAN SHOULD BE DOING, SELLING AND DRINKING
BUDWEISER BEER.
22 BUT ON THAT 4TH OF JULY, I LOST MY OWN INDEPENDENCE.
AT A NEIGHBORHOOD POOL PARTY, I WAS PUSHED IN
23 BACKWARDS, FELL INTO THE SHALLOW END AND BROKE MY
NECK.
24 I DIDN'T KNOW MY LIFE WAS CHANGED THEN.
I WAS COMPLETELY PARALYZED BUT I STILL WAS RESPONDING
25 LIKE NOTHING HAD HAPPENED.
AS THE AMBULANCE RACED ME TO THE HOSPITAL I REMEMBER

3

1 ASKING MY BOYFRIEND TO CALL WORK AND TELL THEM I'D BE
LATE THE NEXT DAY AND TO MAKE SURE HE BROUGHT MY
2 MASCARA TO THE HOSPITAL.
I WENT THROUGH 12 HOURS OF TERRIFYING SURGERY DURING
3 WHICH TIME MY WHOLE FAMILY RUSHED IN TO THE HOSPITAL
FROM ACROSS THE COUNTRY.
4 WE WERE TOLD THAT IF THIS PARALYSIS WAS TEMPORARY,
THEN I WOULD START MOVING THINGS IN THREE DAYS.
5 WELL, THOSE WERE THE LONGEST THREE DAYS OF MY LIFE.
MY WHOLE FAMILY KEPT AN ANXIOUS VIGIL WAITING FOR ME
6 AND ASKING EVERY COUPLE OF HOURS IF I COULD FEEL
ANYTHING OR IF I COULD MOVE MY TOES.
7 THREE DAYS LATER, NOTHING.
THE SENSE OF DISABILITY FOR ALL OF US WAS
8 OVERWHELMING.
I KNEW MY LIFE HAD CHANGED.
9 LIFE AS I KNEW IT WAS OVER.
I DIDN'T KNOW IF I WOULD EVER WORK AGAIN OR OF COURSE
10 EVER HAVE FUN AGAIN.
IN MY REHABILITATION THEN I BEGAN THE HARDEST
11 CHALLENGE I WOULD EVER FACE, BUT IN THAT PROCESS I
GREW INTO A BETTER, STRONGER PERSON.
12 I LEARNED AND DEVELOPED GOALS AND TRAITS THAT WOULD
HELP ME AND TAKE ME THROUGH LIFE AND LIFE'S
13 CHALLENGES, GOAL SETTING, PERSEVERANCE,
DETERMINATION, SELF-CONFIDENCE AND ESPECIALLY PROBLEM
14 SOLVING.
WHEN YOU DON'T HAVE ANY HAND FUNCTION AND YOU APPLY
15 MASCARA AS WELL AS I DO, I WASN'T GOING TO LET ANYONE
ELSE DO IT FOR ME! SO YOU SPEND 16 HOURS A DAY
16 RELEARNING THE EASIEST TASKS THAT YOU -- EVERYONE
ELSE TAKES FOR GRANTED.
17 YOU CAN'T DO THAT WITHOUT HONING PROBLEM SOLVING
SKILLS AND BECOMING AN EXPERT PROBLEM SOLVER.
18 I FELT IN THE HOSPITAL THAT I WAS DEVELOPING TRAITS
THAT WOULD MAKE ME A VALUABLE EMPLOYEE FOR ANY
19 COMPANY.
KEEP IN MIND THAT WHEN YOU'RE IN BUSINESS SCHOOL YOU
20 SPEND EVERY WAKING MINUTE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW
YOU'RE GOING TO GET THE BEST JOB AFTER GRADUATION.
21 I COULDN'T WAIT TO GET OUT AND LET THOSE COMPANIES
COMPETE FOR ME.
22 UNFORTUNATELY, WHEN I DID GET OUT I REALIZED THOSE
COMPANIES HAD A DIFFERENT PLAN.
23 I STARTED TO FACE THE DISCRIMINATION THAT PEOPLE WITH
DISABILITIES ARE ALL TOO FAMILIAR WITH.
24 AT ONE BUSINESS MEETING I HAD A WOMAN COME UP TO ME
AFTERWARDS WHEN I THOUGHT I WAS BEING HEARD AND MY
25 MESSAGES WERE GETTING THROUGH, AND SHE HUGGED ME AND
SAID I KNOW WHAT YOU'RE GOING THROUGH, I HAVE ONE OF

4

1 YOU AT HOME.
ONE OF WHAT?
2 I WAS -- I HAD THIS VISION OF THIS POOR LITTLE GIRL
IN A WHEELCHAIR STUCK IN A CLOSET OR A BASEMENT OR
3 SOMETHING.
I WOULD GO OUT TO STORAGE AND SALES PEOPLE WOULD TALK
4 TO MY FRIENDS AND NOT ME.
I FELT IGNORED, I WAS AVOIDED AND IN THE WORST CASES
5 PEOPLE WOULD JUST PAT ME ON THE HEAD.
WELL THEN AND THERE I DEVELOPED A
6 CONVICTION THAT I HAD NEVER HAD FOR ANYTHING ELSE,
NOT EVEN FOR SELLING BEER.
7 I TURNED MY EFFORTS INTO ADVOCACY TO JOIN THOSE WHO
BEFORE ME HAVE WORKED SO HARD TO FIGHT FOR THE RIGHTS
8 OF PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES, TO BREAK DOWN
ATTITUDINAL BARRIERS AND GET PEOPLE TO RECOGNIZE OUR
9 CAPABILITIES AND NOT -- AND OVER LOOK OUR
DISABILITIES.
10 I'M REALLY PROUD AND PRIVILEGED NOW TO WORK WITH AN
ADMINISTRATION AND A PRESIDENT WHO FEELS AND SHARES
11 THE SAME GOAL THEY DO.
WITH ONLY A FEW DAYS OF HIS TAKING OFFICE, PRESIDENT
12 BUSH ANNOUNCED HIS NEW FREEDOM INITIATIVE.
I KNOW YOU GUISE ARE FAMILIAR WITH IT, BUT IT'S A
13 COMPREHENSIVE PROGRAM TO INTEGRATE PEOPLE WITH
DISABILITIES INTO THE COMMUNITY AND INTO THE WORK
14 FORCE.
AT THE EVENT HE HELD AN EVENT ON FEBRUARY 1 WITH
15 HUNDREDS OF DISABILITY ADVOCATES AND LEADERS IN
ATTENDANCE.
16 HE HAD HAD HIS AIDES CREATE A PODIUM AT SEATED LEVEL
SO HE COULD PRESENT HIS PROGRAM EYE TO EYE WITH
17 SEVERAL PEOPLE IN THE AUDIENCE.
HE SENT A VERY CLEAR MESSAGE THAT DAY THAT THIS IS
18 NOT POLICY DEVELOPED FOR PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES BUT
POLICY DEVELOPED WITH PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES.
19 LET ME TELL YOU A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE EMPLOYMENT
INITIATIVES AND THE NEW FREEDOM INITIATIVE AND YOU
20 CAN GO TO WWW.WHITE HOUSE.GOV IF YOU WANT TO LOOK AT
THE WHOLE THING.
21 AND I RECOMMEND IT.
IT'S WONDERFUL READING.
22 SOME OF THE THINGS THAT THE NEW FREEDOM INITIATIVE
INCORPORATES TO PROMOTE EMPLOYMENT ARE INCREASING
23 ACCESS TO ASSISTIVE AND UNIVERSALLY DESIGNED
TECHNOLOGY, PROMOTING HOMEOWNERSHIP FOR PEOPLE WHO
24 WANT TO GET BACK TO WORK, IMPLEMENTING THE TICKET
WORK INCENTIVE IMPROVEMENT ACT, AGGRESSIVELY
25 ENFORCING THE AMERICANS WITH DISABILITIES ACT AND
EXPANDING TRANSPORTATION OPTIONS FOR PEOPLE.

5

1 TO INCREASE THE ACCESS TO ASSISTIVE TECHNOLOGY, THE
PRESIDENT HAS PROPOSED $20 MILLION TO THE
2 REHABILITATION, ENGINEERING, AND RESEARCH CENTERS,
UNIVERSITY-BASED CENTERS THAT ARE DOING THE MOST
3 PROGRESSIVE RESEARCH IN THE COUNTRY ON NEW
TECHNOLOGIES.
4 $3 MILLION TO THE INTERAGENCY COUNCIL ON DISABILITY
RESEARCH TO HELP COORDINATE FEDERAL AGENCY ASSISTIVE
5 TECHNOLOGY RESEARCH AND FOSTER PUBLIC/PRIVATE
PARTNERSHIPS WITH COMPANIES THAT ARE DEVELOPING
6 ASSISTIVE TECHNOLOGY.
PROMOTING SMALL BUSINESS INNOVATION, $5 MILLION WILL
7 GO TOWARDS HELPING SMALL BUSINESSES WHO OTHERWISE
WOULDN'T HAVE THE FUNDING TO TEST AND MARKET AND
8 DEMONSTRATE PRODUCTS, NEW ASSISTIVE TECHNOLOGY
PRODUCTS.
9 AND FINALLY MAKING ASSISTIVE TECHNOLOGY MORE
AFFORDABLE.
10 THE PRESIDENT HAS PROPOSED $40 MILLION IN MICRO LOANS
SO PEOPLE CAN BUY VERY EXPENSIVE EQUIPMENT.
11 I USE A TYPING AID TO HELP ME TYPE ON MY COMPUTER
THAT COST FIVE BUCKS WHEN MY WHEELCHAIR IS $8,000.
12 AND THE COMPUTER EQUIPMENT CAN RANGE TO THE 20 AND 30
THOUSAND DOLLAR PRICE TAG.
13 THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT PROGRAM AND WE LOOK FORWARD
TO SEEING CONGRESS PASS AN APPROPRIATIONS BILL THAT
14 INCLUDES ALL THE FUNDING IN THE NEW FREEDOM
INITIATIVE BUDGET.
15 IMPLEMENTING THE TICKET TO WORK AND WORK INCENTIVES
IMPROVEMENT ACT.
16 THIS IS AN ACT THAT WASED PASSED IN 1998 THAT ALLOWS
PEOPLE WITH DISABILITYS TO GO BACK TO WORK AND KEEP
17 THEIR DISABILITIES.
ALSO ALLOWS PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES MORE CHOICE IN
18 SERVICE PROVIDERS.
SO FOR TRAINING EMPLOYMENT, ALL SORTS OF
19 ORGANIZATIONS AND COMPANIES CAN BECOME TICKET TAKERS.
PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES WILL HAVE A TICKET THAT THEY
20 CAN TAKE TO AN ORGANIZATION TO GET THE TRAINING THAT
THEY NEED FOR EMPLOYMENT EXPANDING TELECOMMUTING
21 OPTIONS.
$20 MILLION WILL GO TO THE ACCESS TO TELEWORK FUND SO
22 THAT PEOPLE CAN PURCHASE COMPUTER EQUIPMENT THAT WILL
ALLOW THEM TO WORK FROM HOME IN THEIR OWN BUSINESSES
23 OR WITH COMPANIES THAT ALLOW THE TELECOMMUTING.
AND ANOTHER INCENTIVE FOR TELECOMMUTERS, THE
24 PRESIDENT HAS PROPOSED TO MAKE TELECOMMUTING THE
PURCHASE AND DONATION OF EQUIPMENT TO EMPLOYEES BY
25 COMPANIES A TAX-FREE BENEFIT.
FACILITATING ADA COMPLIANCE.

6

1 THE PRESIDENT HAS ENSURED FULL ENFORCEMENT OF THE
AMERICANS WITH DISABILITIES ACT BY THE DEPARTMENT OF
2 J. HE HAS ALSO PROPOSED $5 MILLION TO THE SMALL
BUSINESS ADMINISTRATION TO HELP TRAIN AND PROMOTE
3 EMPLOYMENT FOR PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES AMONG SMALL
BUSINESSES WHO AS WE KNOW WILL OFFER THE MOST JOBS
4 AND THE BEST OPPORTUNITY FOR PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES
AND FOR EVERYBODY IN THE FUTURE.
5 AND THEN PROMOTION OF THE DISABLED ACCESS CREDIT,
THIS IS A CREDIT, A TAX INCENTIVE FOR PEOPLE -- FOR
6 SMALL BUSINESS SAIDS TO PURCHASE THE TECHNOLOGY AND
ACCOMMODATIONS THAT PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES NEED.
7 THIS IS NOT DISCOUNTING EMPLOYEES.
WE ARE PROMOTING PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES AND THEIR
8 STRENGTHS BECAUSE WE KNOW THAT PEOPLE WITH
DISABILITIES CAN DO THE JOB.
9 IF IT TAKES A LITTLE BIT OF EXTRA MONEY JUST TO ALLOW
THAT PERSON TO DO THE JOB IN THE MOST PRODUCTIVE
10 MANNER, THEN THE GOVERNMENT IS THERE TO HELP SMALL
BUSINESSES MAKE THAT INVESTMENT.
11 AND THEN SUPPORTING INNOVATIVE TRANSPORTATION
OPTIONS.
12 THE PRESIDENT HAS PROPOSED IN THE DEPARTMENT OF
TRANSPORTATION BILL $145 MILLION IN GRANTS AND PILOT
13 PROGRAMS TO COME UP WITH INNOVATIVE TRANSPORTATION
OPTIONS.
14 WE ALL KNOW THAT TRANSPORTATION CAN BE A HORRIBLE
BARRIER TO WORK, TO INTEGRATION INTO THE COMMUNITY.
15 NOW, I WANT TO TELL YOU AGAIN, CONGRESS IS LOOKING AT
THE BILLS RIGHT NOW, AND WE HAVE SENT OUT EDUCATIONAL
16 TALKING POINTS ON THESE BUDGET ITEMS AND THERE ARE
OTHER BUDGET ITEMS IN THE NEW FREEDOM INITIATIVE THAT
17 I HAVEN'T TOLD YOU ABOUT.
IF YOU WANT TO GIVE BETHANY, MY LOVELY ASSISTANT IN
18 THE BACK THERE A BUSINESS CARD, I WILL MAKE SURE THAT
YOU ARE ON OUR DISTRIBUTION LIST AND YOU WILL GET
19 INFORMATION FROM THE WHITE HOUSE ON THE FREEWAY
INITIATIVE, AND THROUGHOUT THE YEAR ALL ABOUT THE
20 DIFFERENT THINGS THAT WE'RE DOING TO BENEFIT PEOPLE
WITH DISABILITIES.
21 YOU ALSO MAY KNOW THAT THE PRESIDENT CAME
OUT VERY STRONGLY BEHIND SECTION 508 IMPLEMENTATION
22 LAST SUMMER.
WE ARE STILL LOOKING AT SECTION 508 NOW AND WAYS TO
23 STRENGTHEN THAT.
BECAUSE THIS IS THE KEY FOR THE GOVERNMENT NOT ONLY
24 TO INCREASE ACCESS TO EMPLOYMENT FOR PEOPLE WITH
DISABILITIES BUT TO BE MORE RESPONSIVE TO CUSTOMERS
25 WITH DISABILITIES.
NOW, I WANT TO TELL YOU AGAIN JUST ANOTHER LITTLE

7

1 STORY THAT REALLY MADE ME BELIEVE VERY STRONGLY THAT
THE PRESIDENT IS WITH US AND SUPPORTS SO MUCH THE
2 EMPLOYMENT AND THE INTEGRATION OF PEOPLE WITH
DISABILITIES.
3 TWO WEEKS AGO IN THE AFTERMATH OF THE SEPTEMBER 11
EVENTS, I WAS HONORED TO STAND BEHIND THE PRESIDENT
4 WITH THE REST OF THE WHITE HOUSE STAFF WHEN THE
PRESIDENT HELD A MOMENT OF SILENCE ON THE SOUTH LAWN.
5 AFTERWARDS AS HE WAS GOING THROUGH AND ACKNOWLEDGING
HIS STAFF, HE CAME OVER TO ME AND HE GAVE ME A PAT,
6 BUT ON THE BACK AS A COLLEAGUE, NOT ON THE HEAD.
THANK YOU SO MUCH.
7 I LOOK FORWARD TO WORKING WITH YOU ON THE NEW FREEDOM
INITIATIVE PHASE 2 AND PLEASE KEEP IN TOUCH WITH ME
8 AND HAVE A GREAT CONFERENCE.
(APPLAUSE)
9 .
.
10 >> THANK YOU, JENNIFER.
WE HAVE A SMALL TOKEN OF OUR ESTEEM.
11 >> YIPPEE! THANK YOU.
>> IT'S PROOF THAT SHE SPOKE HERE ASK THEE
12 DID A WONDERFUL JOB.
I HAD NOT BEEN AS FAMILIAR WITH THE PROGRAM AS I
13 SHOULD HAVE BEEN.
I WAS QUITE IMPRESSED BY ALL THE THINGS GOING ON
14 AROUND THE VERGE GOING O. I GATHER SOME OF THE THINGS
ARE IN THE HANDS OF THE CONGRESS SO WE HAVE SOME
15 THINGS TO STILL WORK OUT.
BUT ANYWAY, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
16 OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS BONNIE SAINT JOHN, A WOMAN WHO
HAS ALWAYS THRIVED IN SITUATIONS WHERE THE PATH AHEAD
17 IS NOT CLEARLY MARKED AND THE COMPETITION IS INTENSE.
SHE'S FROM A FAMILY OF MODEST MEANS BUT BECAME AN
18 AMPUTEE AT AGE 5 AND AGAINST TREMENDOUS ODDS, SHE
BECAME A Silver MEDDLE WINNER IN DOWNHILL SKIING IN
19 THE 1984 PARAOLYMPICS IN INSBRUK, AUSTRIA. SHE HAS
AN HONORS DEGREE FROM HARVARD, A ROADS SCHOLARSHIP,
20 [] A POSITION ON THE WHITE HOUSE ECONOMIC COUNCIL,
AND A REMARKABLE SUCCESS AS AN OWNER OF HER OWNS
21 BUSINESS.
NBC NIGHTLY NEWS SELECTED BONE AS ONE OF THE FIVE
22 MOST INSPIRING WOMEN IN AMERICA.
BONNIE?
23 (APPLAUSE)
BY SKWRAO:
24 Q. ?
>>I HAVE A TIGHT SKIRT.
25 THAT'S MY DISABILITY TODAY.
(LAUGHTER) PEOPLE WONDER HOW DID AN

8

1 AFRICAN AMERICAN GIRL WITH ONE LEG FROM SAN DIEGO
WHERE THERE ISN'T EVEN ANY SNOW DECIDE TO GO TO THE
2 OLYMPICS AND WIN MEDALS IN SKIING?
HAVING DONE SOMETHING THAT IS SO FAR OUTSIDE THE BOX
3 OF WHAT PEOPLE EXPECT, YOU MIGHT THINK I WOULD JUST
BUY A BUSHEL OF LAURELS AND SIT ON THEM.
4 WHY GO ON TO WALL STREET, TO THE WHITE HOUSE, OR TO
DO SOMETHING REALLY DIFFICULT LIKE START A FAMILY?
5 WHY DO WE KEEP CHALLENGING OURSELVES AND GROWING AND
STRETCHING OURSELVES?
6 I WAS RAISED ON VISION.
VISION IS THE ABILITY TO SEE SOMETHING THAT ISN'T
7 THERE AND GO AFTER IT.
AND I DON'T KNOW ABOUT YOU, BUT ANYBODY WHO GREW UP
8 IN A HOUSEHOLD WITHOUT A LOT OF MONEY, THAT'S THE WAY
YOU HAD TO LIVE, WAS TO SEE THINGS THAT WEREN'T THERE
9 AND GO AFTER THEM.
AND THAT WAS THE LEGACY I WAS RAISED WITH.
10 IN THE LAST FEW WEEKS I'VE HAD MANY CONVERSATIONS
WITH PEOPLE ABOUT SECTION 508, AND I'VE BEEN
11 ASTOUNDED BY THE BREATHTAKING VISION THAT IS THERE,
THE POSSIBILITY OF CREATING A MARKETPLACE, A FREE
12 MARKETPLACE WITH PRODUCTS AND SERVICES AND TOOLS THAT
REALLY INCLUDE EVERYONE.
13 PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES, PEOPLE THAT SPEAK DIFFERENT
LANGUAGES, PEOPLE THAT WANT TO USE THE INTERNET WHILE
14 THEY'RE DRIVING.
(LAUGHTER) THE POSSIBILITIES ARE
15 BREATHTAKING.
OF WHAT SECTION 508 WILL DO IN OUR MARKETPLACE.
16 YOU KNOW, WE ALL GET A LITTLE BIT EMOTIONAL WHEN WE
THINK ABOUT SEPTEMBER 11 AND WHAT'S BEEN HAPPENING
17 SINCE THEN.
AND I WAS THINKING ABOUT THAT AND I WAS THINKING
18 ABOUT SECTION 508, AND I THOUGHT, YOU KNOW, THIS IS
VERY IMPORTANT BECAUSE WHAT WE'RE DOING IS WE'RE
19 DOING SOMETHING UNIQUELY AMERICAN! OTHER COUNTRIES
DON'T DO THIS.
20 THIS IS ABOUT CAPITALISM.
THIS IS ABOUT BUYING IN A WAY THAT CHANGES THE WORLD.
21 IT'S NOT ABOUT SAYING WE'RE GOING TO GO AND MANDATE
BUILDING THESE PRODUCTS AND WE'RE GOING TO BUILD THEM
22 TO GOVERNMENT SPEC AND -- NO.
WE'RE JUST SAYING WE'RE GOING TO USE OUR BUYING POWER
23 TO STIMULATE THE GENIUS AND THE CREATIVITY OF
AMERICANS AND AMERICAN COMPANIES AND LET THEM TAKE
24 THE BANNER AND RUN WITH IT.
IT'S SO AMERICAN! IT'S THE WAY WE DO IT! AND IT'S
25 ABOUT INCLUSION.
IT'S ABOUT SAYING EVERYBODY MATTERS.

9

1 EACH AND EVERY ONE OF US MATTER AND WE'RE GOING TO
BUY, WE'RE GOING TO SPEND OUR MONEY IN A WAY THAT
2 SAYS WE MATTER.
I LOVE AMERICA! I REALLY DO, BECAUSE WE'RE THE ONLY
3 ONES WHO COULD FACT TACKLE A PROBLEM LIKE THIS THIS
WAY.
4 IT IS SO CREATIVE, IT IS SO CAPITALIST AND YET IT'S
RELYING ON THE GOVERNMENT AND IT'S INCLUDING
5 EVERYONE.
I DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT SECTION 508 BEFORE A FEW WEEKS
6 AGO.
AND I'M ASTOUNDED BY THE BREATHTAKING VISION OF
7 WHAT'S POSSIBLE.
I THINK 10 YEARS FROM NOW PEOPLE WILL LOOK BACK ON
8 THIS THE WAY THEY DO THE SPACE RESEARCH THAT CREATED
SO MANY PRODUCTS IN THE AMERICAN ECONOMY: TEFLON --
9 AND I DON'T KNOW ALL THE DIFFERENT THINGS THAT CAME
OUT OF THE SPACE PROGRAM, BUT SO MANY THINGS THAT
10 CREATED NEW INDUSTRIES AND JOBS AND EXPANDED
POSSIBILITIES.
11 AND I THINK SECTION 508 IS ONE OF THOSE OPPORTUNITIES
THAT THE GOVERNMENT IS SHOWING THE FORESIGHT TO TAKE.
12 AT THE SAME TIME WHILE I REALIZE IT'S SUCH A
BREATHTAKING VISION, I ALSO RECOGNIZE THAT THERE'S A
13 PRICE TO BE PAID.
AND THAT YOU ALL SITTING HERE ARE THE PEOPLE WHO PAY
14 THE PRICE.
SOME OF YOU WILL HAVE TO WORK LONGER HOURS TO MAKE
15 THINGS WORK, SOME OF YOU WILL HAVE TO LEARN NEW
SKILLS, SOME OF YOU WILL HAVE TO JUGGLE BUDGETS THAT
16 WILL BECOME MUCH TIGHTER BECAUSE OF THE BUYING
DECISIONS YOU HAVE TO MAKE.
17 SO I SALUTE YOU TODAY AS THE HEROES OF 508.
YOU ARE THE ONES WHO WILL MAKE THIS VISION A REALITY.
18 LATER ON IT MAY BE THAT IT'S EASY THAT THE PRICES
HAVE COME DOWN, THE MARKETPLACE IS FUNCTIONING, BUT
19 RIGHT NOW IT'S NOT ALWAYS GOING TO BE EASY.
TO DO.
20 I SALUTE YOU AS THE HEROES OF FIVE 08.
NOW I KNOW THAT NOT ALL HEROES ARE NECESSARILY GUNG
21 HOE.
A LOT OF HEROES ARE RELUCTANT.
22 IN FACT, WHEN YOU READ JOSEPH CAMPBELL ON HEROES ON
THE CLASSIC EVOLUTION OF A HERO, THE CLASSIC PATTERN
23 IS THAT THERE'S A CALL TO ACTION AND THE HERO SAYS
NO, UH-UH, I'M NOT GOING, I DON'T WANT TO DO THAT,
24 THAT'S TOO HARD.
AND THEN THE SITUATION CHANGES AND THERE'S ANOTHER
25 CALL TO ACTION.
AND THE HERO SAYS I DON'T KNOW -- NO.

10

1 AND USUALLY IN MANY OF OUR FAVORITE STORIES THE HERO
IS EVENTUALLY FORCED INTO THE FRAY AND MUST GRAPPLE
2 WITH THE DIFFICULTIES.
STAR WARS AS AN EXAMPLE, FINALLY WHEN LUKE
3 SKYWALKER'S ENTIRE FAMILY IS WIPED OUT IS WHEN HE
FINALLY HAS TO GO AND BE A HERO.
4 SO SOME OF YOU MAY FEEL 508 -- WHEN DID 508 START, IN
'98?
5 NO, 508 STARTED A WHILE BACK AND -- '96.
OR '86, WOW! SO THERE'S BEEN A CALL TO ACTION,
6 THERE'S BEEN ANOTHER CALL TO ACTION AND FINALLY WE'RE
IN A POSITION TO WHERE WE MUST GO, WE HAVE NO CHOICE.
7 WE ARE ALL GOING INTO BATTLE WITH 508.
AND WE'RE ALL GOING IN TOGETHER.
8 SO SOME OF US MAY BE RELUCTANT HEROES AND SOME OF US
MAY BE GUNG HO, BUT TOGETHER WE ARE THE ONES WHO ARE
9 GOING TO MAKE THE DIFFERENCE AND CREATE THIS
BREATHTAKING VISION.
10 THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR WHAT YOU'RE DOING TO CHANGE OUR
WORLD.
11 THANK YOU FOR MAKING AMERICA BETTER AND STRONGER AND
WE AS A WORK FORCE WILL BE MORE COMPETITIVE, OUR
12 PRODUCTS WILL HAVE UNIQUE ADVANTAGES BECAUSE OF THE
CHALLENGES YOU TAKE ON TODAY.
13 PEOPLE LOOK AT ME NOW AND I HAVE OLYMPIC MEDALS AND I
CAN WALK ONSTAGE ALMOST WITHOUT TRIPPING AND THEY
14 THINK, YOU KNOW, YOU DON'T LOOK HANDICAPPED.
BUT I DIDN'T ALWAYS START OUT LIFE THIS WAY.
15 I WAS BORN WITH A BIRTH DEFECT, THE GROWTH WAS
STUNTED IN MY RIGHT LEG, AND I WORE A HEAVY BRACE
16 THEY DRAGGED AROUND.
I COULDN'T RUN AND PLAY WITH OTHER KIDS AND FINALLY
17 WHEN I WAS FIVE YEARS OLD, THE DOCTOR SAID HER LEG
JUST ISN'T GOING TO GROW AND TOLD MY PARENTS THAT
18 THEY REALLY NEEDED TOASMITATE MY FOOT SO I COULD WEAR
A PROSTHESIS.
19 I WAS ROLLED DOWN THE HALLWAY INTO THE OPERATING
ROOM.
20 I CAN STILL REMEMBER BEING PLACED ON THIS ICE COLD
OPERATING TABLE AND JUMPING, I REMEMBER THINKING I'LL
21 NEVER GO TO SLEEP NOW.
AND IT'S AS IF IN A BLINK OF AN EYE THE WHOLE THING
22 IS OVER.
AND I REMEMBER WAKING UP IN THE RECOVERY ROOM AND
23 REACHING DOWN AND JUST FEELING A STUMP WHERE MY LEG
USED TO BE.
24 I OFTEN SPEAK AT SCHOOLS AND LITTLE KIDS ALWAYS ASK
DID IT HURT?
25 DID IT HURT WHEN THEY CUT OFF YOUR LEG?
AND I THINK THEY'RE IMAGINING A BIG SAW.

11

1 OF COURSE YOU DON'T FEEL A THING BECAUSE YOU'RE
ANESTHETIZED.
2 IT'S ONLY AFTERWARDS IN THE HEALING THAT YOU FEEL
PAIN.
3 THERE WAS A THERAPY I REMEMBER WHERE THEY PILED
TELEPHONE BOOKS IN A PILE AND PUT A BATHROOM SCALE ON
4 THE TOP.
I HAD TO PUSH WITH THE END OF MY STUMP TO TOUGHEN UP
5 THE NERVE ENDINGS IN MY LEG SO THEY WOULD BE ABLE TO
WEAR A PROSTHESIS.
6 THERE WAS A NURSE WHO SAT BESIDE ME DAY AFTER DAY
READING THE SCALE AND SHE WOULD SAY BONNIE, FIVE
7 POUNDS ISN'T ENOUGH; YOU HAVE TO PUSH HARDER.
YOU HAVE TO PUSH HARDER! AND SHE WOULD BADGER ME
8 UNTIL THE TEARS RAN DOWN MY FACE.
I HATED HER! BUT YOU KNOW, LOOKING BACK NOW, I
9 REALIZED SHE LOVED ME.
SHE DIDN'T EVEN KNOW MY NAME.
10 I DON'T EVEN REMEMBER HER NAME.
BUT SHE LOVED ME ENOUGH TO PUSH ME THROUGH THAT PAIN
11 AND DIFFICULTY BECAUSE SHE COULD SEE THE VISION OF
WHERE I COULD GO.
12 SHE DIDN'T WANT ME TO HOBBLE THROUGH LIFE! SHE
DIDN'T WANT ME TO JUST TAKE A DESK JOB BECAUSE I WAS
13 AFRAID TO DO ANYTHING ELSE.
SHE WANTED ME TO HAVE IT ALL.
14 SHE WANTED ME TO DANCE AT MY WEDDING, TO CARRY MY
BABY DAUGHTER UP THE STAIRS, TO BECOME AN OLYMPIC SKI
15 CHAMPION.
SO SHE PUSHED ME THROUGH THE DIFFICULTIES AND THE
16 CHALLENGES SO THAT I COULD HAVE IT ALL.
NOT ONLY DID SHE TEACH ME HOW TO WALK, BUT SHE TAUGHT
17 ME SUCH AN IMPORTANT LIFE LESSON.
JENNIFER SAID EARLIER ABOUT HAVING TO STRUGGLE TO
18 LEARN SOMETHING THAT EVERYONE ELSE TAKES FOR GRANTED.
I HAD TO STRUGGLE AND FIGHT TO LEARN HOW TO WALK WHEN
19 ALL THE OTHER FIVE YEAR-OLDS JUST TOOK IT FOR
GRANTED.
20 I LEARNED THE IMPORTANCE OF REALIZING LIFE
ISN'T FAIR.
21 SOMETIMES WE JUST HAVE TO WORK HARD TO HAVE SOMETHING
EVERYONE ELSE HAS.
22 GROWING UP I HAD SO MANY THINGS IN MY ENVIRONMENT
THAT IDENTIFIED ME AS THE HANDICAPPED KID.
23 EVEN THOUGH I COULD WALK, I COULDN'T BE ON SPORTS
TEAMS WITH THE OTHER KIDS IN HIGH SCHOOL.
24 I READ BOOKS ON THE PLAYGROUND WHEN OTHER KIDS WERE
JUMPING ROPE AND PLAYING HOP SCOTCH.
25 THERE WAS A SPECIAL BUS THAT PICKED ME UP AT MY DOOR
AND TOOK ME TO SCHOOL AND BACK, SO I COULDN'T PLAY

12

1 WITH OTHER KIDS AFTER SCHOOL.
SO LITTLE THINGS THAT YOU TAKE FOR GRANTED WERE
2 DIFFERENT FOR ME.
I REMEMBER THE EXPRESSION, I DON'T KNOW IF ANY OF YOU
3 HAVE HEARD THIS EXPRESSION BEFORE, HE'LL GO FOR
ANYTHING ON TWO LEGS?
4 I REMEMBER HEARING THAT AND THINKING, GREAT, I'LL
NEVER EVEN GET A DATE!
5 (LAUGHTER).
SO MANY LITTLE THINGS IN MY ENVIRONMENT
6 THAT WERE SIGNALS TELLING ME YOU'RE NOT AS GOOD AS.
YOU DON'T EVEN MAKE THE BOTTOM OF THE BARREL.
7 I WENT ON EXCHANGE.
I APPLIED FOR AN EXCHANGE PROGRAM WHEN I WAS 15 YEARS
8 OLD, YOU KNOW THE FOREIGN STUDENTS THAT GO BACK AND
FORTH?
9 WELL AT 15 I WASN'T OLD ENOUGH TO GO OVERSEAS.
SO THEY SAID WE'LL PUT YOU ON EXCHANGE FROM SAN DIEGO
10 TO CHICAGO.
SO I WENT TO DOWNERS GROVE, ILLINOIS ON EXCHANGE.
11 AND I HAD PUT ON THE APPLICATION THAT I NEEDED NO
SPECIAL ACOMMENDATION FOR DISABILITY.
12 AND WHEN I GOT THERE THE PARENTS IN THE HOUSE SAID
WELL ALL OUR KIDS HAVE ALWAYS WALKED TO SCHOOL.
13 SO I SAID OKAY, I'LL WALK TO SCHOOL.
AND I FELT SO STRONGLY THAT I HAD SAID I AM NOT
14 HANDICAPPED, I'M GOING ON EXCHANGE AND I'M NOT
HANDICAPPED, THAT I FELT I HAD TO DO WHATEVER WOULD
15 BE EXPECTED OF EVERYONE ELSE.
AND I WALKED TO SCHOOL EVERY DAY; I WALKED THERE AND
16 BACK.
WELL, AFTER A WHILE, MY STUMP INSIDE MY PROSTHESIS
17 WAS SWOLLEN, I HAD A RASH, THE SKIN WAS STARTING TO
CHAFE BUT I WOULDN'T TELL ANYONE.
18 I WENT HOME AT NIGHT AND PUT LOTION ON IT AND TRIED
TO MAKE IT BETTER AND IN THE MORNING I WOULD WRAP IT
19 WITH MASKING TAP TO STOP THE CHAFING AND WALK AGAIN
TO SCHOOL AND BACK.
20 OVER AND OVER.
AND I KNOW THAT EXPERIENCE IS REPEATED SO MANY TIMES
21 IN THE WORKPLACE.
PEOPLE GO AND APPLY FOR A JOB AND SAY I'M NOT
22 DISABLED.
AND THEN THEY HAVE TO HIDE WHATEVER THEIR
23 DIFFICULTIES MAY BE AND THEY STRUGGLE AND THEY WANT
TO WORK, THEY WANT TO CONTRIBUTE, BUT THEY HIDE
24 WHATEVER THEIR DISABILITIES ARE AND THEY REFUSE TO
ASK FOR HELP.
25 I MEAN, YOU MAY THINK ABOUT ME AS A 15 YEAR-OLD GIRL
WALKING TO SCHOOL AND THINK HOW RIDICULOUS, IF ONLY

13

1 SHE HAD ASKED FOR HELP! AND THEY WOULD HAVE.
I KNOW THAT TOO NOW.
2 BUT I WAS AFRAID TO ASK FOR HELP.
I FELT I HAD MADE A COMMITMENT THAT I DIDN'T NEED
3 HELP AND I HAD TO ASSISTANT BY THAT.
SO MANY PEOPLE IN THE WORKPLACE ARE CLOSET DISABLED
4 PEOPLE.
I THINK IT'S EASIER TO COME OUT AND BE GAY NOW THAN
5 IT IS TO COME OUT AND BE DISABLED.
PEOPLE ARE AFRAID TO ASK FOR SECTION 504 ASSISTANCE.
6 AND PART OF THE BREATHTAKING VISION OF 508 IS THAT
PEOPLE DON'T HAVE TO BE LABELED, PEOPLE DON'T HAVE TO
7 IDENTIFY AND PUT THEMSELVES OUT THERE AND BE AFRAID
OF WHAT IT'S GOING TO DO FOR THEIR CAREER WHEN THE
8 TECHNOLOGY IS PREVALENT AND AVAILABLE.
PEOPLE DON'T HAVE TO BE EXTREMELY DISABLED TO GET
9 HELP.
YOU MIGHT JUST UKNOW, THINK, WOW, BIGGER PRINT MIGHT
10 BE NICE ON MY COMPUTER AND BE ABLE TO HAVE ACCESS TO
THAT BECAUSE EVERYBODY DOES.
11 I THINK THE BIGGEST IMPACT OF 508 IS GOING TO BE TO
LIBERATE THE MILLIONS OF PEOPLE IN THE WORK FORCE WHO
12 ARE ALREADY THERE AND DISABLED AND STRUGGLING.
SOME PEOPLE THINK, WELL, WHY SHOULD WE DO ALL THIS
13 WORK WITH 508?
I DON'T SEE ALL THE DISABLED PEOPLE HERE.
14 I DON'T SEE ENOUGH PEOPLE TO JUSTIFY THIS.
MANY OF THEM ARE HIDDEN AND MANY OF THEM ARE UNABLE
15 TO COME.
IF WE BUILD THE HIGHWAY THEN THE CARS WILL COME.
16 IN AMERICA WHEN THEY PLANNED THE HIGHWAY SYSTEM, THEY
DIDN'T SAY, WELL, LOOK, THERE'S NO CARS HERE NOW, WHY
17 SHOULD WE BUILD A HIGHWAY?
WHEN YOU BUILD THE HIGHWAY OF ACCESSIBLE TECHNOLOGY,
18 TELL ALLOW ALL THE DRIVERS TO COME ON LINE, TO COME
ON THE ROAD AND CONTRIBUTE.
19 AS WE GROW OLDER, AS ALL OF US IN THIS ROOM GROW
OLDER, MORE AND MORE OF US ARE GOING TO HAVE
20 DIFFICULTY seeing, DIFFICULTY HEARING, DIFFICULTY
WITH MOBILITY WITH DEXTERITY,.
21 AND SO THE ROAD YOU'RE BUILDING MAY BE FOR YOU.
YOU MAY BE THE HEROES ON THE FOREFRONT, THE MARINES,
22 THE FIRST ONES IN FOR 508, BUT YOU ALSO MAY BE THE
FIRST PEOPLE TO BENEFIT WHEN THINGS REALLY ARE GOING,
23 WHEN THE MARKETPLACE IS REALLY WORKING.
A LOT OF THE OLDER GENERATION NOW DOESN'T NECESSARILY
24 WANT TO BE ON THE WEB.
PEOPLE WHO ARE AD NOW DON'T NECESSARILY WANT TO DO
25 COMPUTERS.
SOME OF THEM DO, SOME OF THEM DON'T.

14

1 BUT YOU WILL! AND YOUR KIDS WILL.
YOU'RE NOT GOING TO WANT TO BE SHUT OUT.
2 ONCE YOU'VE BEEN IN, ONCE YOU'VE BEEN ON LINE.
SO THE BIGGEST DIFFERENCE YOU WILL MAKE MAY BE FOR
3 YOURSELVES AS YOU BECOME PART OF THE PEOPLE WHO NEED
IT THE MOST.
4 WHEN I WENT TO WORK AT THE WHITE HOUSE, I WAS SO
EXCITED TO BE CONTRIBUTING TO AMERICA, AND I WAS
5 COMING FROM IBM WHERE I HAD WORKED FACILITATING
GROUPS AND RUNNING SEMINARS AND TEAMWORK AND JUST
6 QUALITY IMPROVEMENT, DONE SOME REALLY GREAT THINGS,
AND I THOUGHT I CAN BRING THIS TO THE GOVERNMENT AND
7 REALLY MAKE A DIFFERENCE.
I WAS ON THE NATIONAL ECONOMIC COUNCIL FACILITATING
8 INTERAGENCY TASK FORCES IN THE AREA OF LABOR AND
TRAINING INITIATIVES.
9 AND I WAS SO EXCITED TO BE BRINGING MY AND I WILLS
AND TALENTS AND SERVING THE NATION.
10 AND I ARRIVEDA THE ONE OF THE NEW POLITICAL
APPOINTEES AND VERY QUICKLY REALIZED I KNEW NOTHING.
11 AND MANY PEOPLE FROM MANY AGENCIES WERE KIND ENOUGH
TO TAKE ME UNDER THEIR WING AND TEACH ME AND SHOW ME.
12 I WORKED ON THE WORK FORCE POLICY TASK FORCE.
AND I CAME IN THINKING EVERYTHING I HAD LEARNED ABOUT
13 LEADERSHIP I WAS GOING TO USE.
I HAD LEARNED THAT LEADERSHIP WAS ABOUT VISION,
14 REALLY GOOD LEADERS HAD A VISION THAT THEY SHARED AND
THEY HAD COMMUNICATION WITH PEOPLE ABOUT IT.
15 SO I CAME IN.
ONE OF THE FIRST PROJECTS I WAS ASKED TO WORK ON WAS
16 THE RETRAINING PROGRAM FOR NAFTA.
SO WE HAD EVERYONE COME IN AND THE LABOR DEPARTMENT
17 GAVE A VISION OF WHAT THAT SHOULD LOOK LIKE AND WE
HAD THE DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE AND TRADE AND SOME
18 OTHER AGENCIES THAT WERE AFFECTED BY RETRAINING
PROGRAMS AND I HAD EVERYBODY GIVE INPUT AND I HAD A
19 DEADLINE AND THEY WERE GOING TO WRITE POSITION PAPERS
AND I WAS AN INTERACTIVE LEADER WITH A VISION.
20 I THOUGHT I WAS HOT.
I WAS SURPRISED WHEN EVERYTHING DIDN'T NECESSARILY
21 WORK.
AND I FOUND THAT THERE WERE A VARIETY OF THINGS GOING
22 ON.
THERE WERE PEOPLE WHO DIDN'T HAVE THE SKILLS.
23 THEY MIGHT HAVE BEEN PUT IN THE JOB OR ASSIGNED TO
THE TASK BY SOMEBODY BUT DIDN'T NECESSARILY HAVE THE
24 SKILLS FOR WHAT I WAS ASKING THEM TO DO.
I FOUND THAT THERE WERE PEOPLE WHO DIDN'T WANT TO DO
25 IT.
THERE WERE PEOPLE WHO DIDN'T -- IF THERE WAS SOMEBODY

15

1 WHO DIDN'T LIKE HIS BOSS AND WANTED HIS BOSS TO LOOK
BAD SO HE WASN'T GOING TO DO IT.
2 SO THERE WERE ALL KINDS OF THINGS GOING O. AND WHAT I
FAILED TO REALIZE WAS THAT EVEN THOUGH IT WAS MY
3 DIVISION AND THE DEPARTMENT OF LABOR'S DIVISION, IT
WOULDN'T NECESSARILY BE THEIR VISION.
4 AND I DIDN'T STOP TO THINK HOW THAT COULD WORK
BETTER.
5 THERE WAS A TEAM I WORKED ON LATER THAT WAS CHARGED
WITH CREATING A SHARED VISION AMONG DIFFERENT
6 SEGMENTS OF THE ADMINISTRATION ON THE FUTURE OF THE
WORK FORCE.
7 AND AS WE RECRUITED THOSE PEOPLE TO BE ON THE TEAM,
WE CHECKED IN WITH THEIR VISION AND WHERE THEY WERE
8 COMING FROM AND WHAT THEY WANTED TO ACHIEVE AND
BROUGHT THAT IN AND REALLY WORKED TOGETHER OVER A
9 PERIOD OF EIGHT MONTHS TO HONE A SHARED VISION.
THAT GROUP WAS SO MUCH MORE EFFECTIVE.
10 AT THE END AT MY GOING AWAY PARTY FROM THE
ADMINISTRATION THEY GAVE ME A PEWTER MUG THAT SAID IT
11 WASN'T JUST THE DONUTS.
(LAUGHTER).
12 BECAUSE SEE WE HAD TO MEET EARLY IN THE
MORNING SO MANY TIMES AND I ALWAYS BROUGHT THE DONUTS
13 AND COFFEE AND THEY SAID, YOU KNOW, IT WASN'T JUST
THE DONUTS THAT THEY CAME FOR.
14 IT WAS THAT THEIR VISION WAS RESPECTED, THEIR POINT
OF VIEW WAS APPRECIATED AND INCORPORATED, AND IT WAS
15 AN ENJOYABLE TEAM TO WORK ON.
SO I CHALLENGE YOU TODAY TO THINK ABOUT YOUR VISION,
16 YOUR ROLE IN 508.
AND IS THERE SOMETHING THAT YOU CAN GET EXCITED AND
17 PASSIONATE ABOUT?
SURE, THERE ARE THINGS TO GET IRRITATED ABOUT, THERE
18 ARE THINGS TO GET FRUSTRATED ABOUT, THERE ARE THINGS
THAT YOU THINK YOU'RE BEING ASKED TO DO THAT YOU
19 CAN'T DO.
BUT WHAT IS IT YOU CAN DO?
20 IS THERE SOMETHING YOU WOULD LIKE TO DO FOR 508?
AND EVEN THE ANGER AND FRUSTRATION THAT ANGER AND
21 FRUSTRATION THAT YOU SOMETIMES ENCOUNTER.
THAT CAN BE USED IN A POSITIVE WAY.
22 THAT CAN BE CHANNELED INTO THE COMPANIES THAT YOU
PRODUCE AND YOU'RE BUYING.
23 THAT FRUSTRATION NEEDS TO BE CHANNELED AND
COMMUNICATED TO THE MARKETPLACE, TO YOUR BOSSES, SO
24 THAT IT BECOMES PRODUCTIVE, SO THAT IT BECOMES
PRESSURE FOR CHANGE. WHAT IS YOUR VISION OF 508?
25 HOW WOULD YOU LIKE IT TO BE?
HOW WOULD YOU LIKE IT TO WORK?

16

1 HOW DO YOU THINK IT COULD WORK BETTER?
JENNIFER SAID THE PRESIDENT AND OTHERS ARE CONTINUING
2 TO WORK ON MAKING 508 MORE EFFECTIVE.
HAVE YOU PUT IN YOUR OPINION?
3 HAVE YOU EXPRESSED WHAT IT IS YOU WANT?
HAVE YOU EXPRESSED WHAT IT IS YOU WANT TO DO?
4 WHAT IT IS YOU WANT TO CONTRIBUTE?
AS THIS GOES FORWARD.
5 IT'S SO EASY, WE GET SO BUSY AND I KNOW ALL OF US ARE
OVEREXTENDED.
6 IT'S HARD TO STOP AND TAKE TIME TO REFLECT WHERE WE
ARE WHERE ARE WE GOING, WHAT IS THE VISION NOT JUST
7 TOMORROW BUT DOWN THE LINE.
AND WHEN I LOOK BACK FIVE YEARS FROM NOW WHAT DO I
8 WANT TO SAY THAT I DID THAT I MADE A DIFFERENCE, THAT
I CONTRIBUTED TO A BETTER WORLD.
9 IT'S HARD TO FIND THE TIME TO REFLECT ON THAT, SO I
WANT TO GIVE YOU A MOMENT RIGHT NOW TO STOP AND
10 REFLECT AND THINK ABOUT YOUR ROLE AS ONE OF THE
HEROES OF 508.
11 SO I'D LIKE EACH OF YOU TO TURN TO SOMEONE NEXT TO
YOU AND JUST TAKE A MOMENT TO TALK ABOUT YOUR VISION
12 AND YOUR ROLE IN 508.
GRAB A PARTNER.
13 GO AHEAD.
>> OKAY.
14 EVERYBODY RAISE YOUR HANDS UP IN THE AIR.
I DON'T KNOW WHY, BUT THAT MAKES A ROOM QUIET
15 IMMEDIATELY.
(LAUGHTER).
16 WOULD ANYBODY CARE TO SHARE SOMETHING THAT
THEY HEARD, SOMETHING THAT THEY GOT FROM SOMEBODY
17 ELSE, A VISION, SOMETHING YOU'D LIKE TO DO OR
CONTRIBUTE IN 508?
18 AND IF YOU DON'T WANT TO SHARE NOW, WHAT I'D LIKE TO
SAY IS I'LL BE HERE AFTERWARDS AND I WOULD LOVE TO
19 HEAR.
THAT'S ONE OF MY FAVORITE THINGS THAT I GET TO DO IS
20 TO HEAR YOUR VISION AS WELL.
AND I ASKED PEOPLE THEIR VISIONS AND I THINK IT'S
21 HYPOCRITICAL IF I'M NOT WILLING TO SAY WHAT MY VISION
IS TOO, AND I HAVE TO SAY I'M SO INSPIRED BY 508 I
22 HAVE HAD A SOFTWARE COMPANY WITH MY HUSBAND OVER THE
YEARS AND I'M SERIOUSLY THINKING ABOUT FINDING OUT IF
23 THERE'S SOMETHING WE CAN DO OR SOMETHING WE CAN WRITE
THAT WOULD BE HELPFUL IN CREATING A PRODUCT IN THIS
24 ARENA.
SO THERE'S ONE OF MY VISIONS AND I WOULD LOVE TO HEAR
25 YOUR VISIONS AS YOU THINK ABOUT THEM AND YOU CAN
SHARE THEM WITH ME AFTERWARDS.

17

1 I AM SO MOVED BY WHAT 508 CAN DO AND HOW IT CAN
IMPACT OUR SOCIETY AS A WHOLE FOR AGING PEOPLE, FOR
2 MULTILANGUAGE, TO BE ABLE TO -- THE THINGS THAT WE
HAVE TO DO TO MAKE WEB SITES COMPATIBLE FOR ALL
3 DIFFERENT KINDS OF DISABILITIES, WE HAVE TO PUT TAGS
ON DIFFERENT ITEMS, TEXT TO TAGS AND MAKE THOSE
4 READABLE, EITHER READABLE OUT LOUD OR READABLE IN
DIFFERENT WAYS BUT THAT CAN ALSO BE USED TO CONVERT
5 INTO DIFFERENT LANGUAGES SO WE CAN BRING IN MORE
PEOPLE WITH DIFFERENT LANGUAGES AND DIFFERENT
6 CULTURES.
THERE'S JUST SO MANY IMPACTS FROM 508 THAT GO FAR
7 BEYOND JUST DISABILITY ISSUES.
IT REALLY IS ABOUT INCLUSION AND BRINGING EVERYONE
8 ALONG AND ALLOWING ALL OF US TO FUNCTION BETTER WITH
TECHNOLOGY, NOT JUST A FEW.
9 SO I'M EXCITED ABOUT HEARING YOUR VISIONS AS WE GO
FORWARD.
10 FOR ME BEING A SKIER WAS A HUGE VISION.
IT WAS SOMETHING THAT WASN'T THERE.
11 THERE WERE NO AFRICAN AMERICANS WHO'D WON OLYMPIC
MEDALS IN SKIING BEFORE ME.
12 I WAS THE FIRST AFRICAN AMERICAN TO WIN AN OLYMPIC
MEDAL IN SKIING
13 (APPLAUSE)
(APPLAUSE).
14 >> IT WASN'T SOMETHING I COULD LOOK AT
SOMEONE ELSE AND SAY I WANT TO DO THAT.
15 I HAD TO CARVE MY OWN PATH.
PEOPLE ASK HOW DID YOU EVEN GET THE IDEA YOU WERE
16 GOING TO SKI?
AND I REMEMBER ONE DAY MY MOTHER CAME HOME FROM WORK
17 AND HANDED ME A BROCHURE WITH A SILHOUETTE OF AN
AMPUTEE ON A SKI AND SHE JUST HANDED IT TO ME AND
18 WALKED AWAY SHE WAS A SINGLE MOM, SCHOOL TEACHER
RAISING THREE KIDS.
19 SHE DIDN'T HAVE A LOT OF TIME OR MONEY, BUT OUR
LEGACY WAS DREAMS, VISIONS.
20 AND WE COME BY IT HONESTLY.
HER MOTHER NEVER WENT PAST THE FOURTH GRADE.
21 HER MOTHER IRONED SHIRTS FOR $40 A WEEK.
BUT MY MOTHER TOLD ME HER MOTHER ALWAYS DREAMED OF A
22 BETTER LIFE.
SHE HAD BEEN A MAID IN A HOUSEHOLD AND HAD TO WEAR A
23 UNIFORM AND LIVE IN AND SEND HER DAUGHTERS AWAY TO
LIVE WITH SOMEBODY ELSE.
24 AND WHEN SHE GOT THAT JOB IRONING SHIRTS FOR $40 A
WEEK SHE WAS SO PROUD THAT SHE HAD BECOME AN
25 INDEPENDENT PROFESSIONAL.
SHE COULD LIVE AT HOME, BRING HER CHILDREN, HER

18

1 FAMILY BACK TOGETHER.
I HAVE A HERITAGE OF PEOPLE WHO ALWAYS DREAMED OF
2 MAKING THEIR LIVES AND THEIR WORLD A BETTER PLACE.
MY MOTHER WENT ON FROM BEING A SCHOOL TEACHER TO EARN
3 HER PH.D. AND BECOME A PRINCIPAL AND AFFECT THE LIVES
OF THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS OF STUDENTS, TEACHERS,
4 PARENTS, YOU CAN'T WALK DOWN THE STREET WITH HER IN
SAN DIEGO WITHOUT BEING STOPPED BY PEOPLE WHO SAID
5 YOU MADE A DIFFERENCE FOR ME.
IT'S LIKE WALKING AROUND WITH GANDHI OR SOMETHING.
6 (LAUGHTER).
I COME FROM A HERITAGE OF DREAMERS.
7 I THOUGHT WHEN I WAS IN HIGH SCHOOL THAT WE READ
POETRY AFTER DINNER JUST BECAUSE IT WAS MY PERSONAL
8 CURSE OF BEING BORN TO AN ENGLISH TEACHER.
(LAUGHTER).
9 I DIDN'T REALIZE UNTIL MUCH LATER THAT
POETRY HAD BEEN SOMETHING SHE HAD LONG BEFORE SHE WAS
10 AN ENGLISH TEACHER.
POETRY WAS WHAT SHE USED TO FEED HER SOUL WHEN SHE
11 HAD HOLES IN THE SOLES OF HER SHOES AND SHE HAD TO
PUT CARDBOARD IN AND SHE DIDN'T ALWAYS HAVE ENOUGH
12 FOOD TO EAT.
SHE READ POEMS LIKE LONGFELLOW, AN ASSUME OF LIFE.
13 TELL ME NOT IN MOURNFUL NUMBERS LIFE IS BUT AN EMPTY
DREAM.
14 THE SOUL IS DEAD THAT SLUMBERS, THINGS ARE NOT WHAT
THEY SEEM.
15 LIFE IS REAL, LIFE IS ERNEST, THE GRAVE IS NOT OUR
GOAL.
16 DOST,ART TO DUST RETURN ETHWASN'T SPOKEN OF YOUR
SOUL.
17 THE LIVES OF GREAT MEN ALL REMIND US WE CAN MAKE OUR
LIVES SUBLIME AND DEPARTING LEAVE BEHIND US
18 FOOTPRINTS ON THE SANDS OF TIME.
YOU IN THIS ROOM WILL TRULY LEAVE YOUR FOOTPRINTS ON
19 THE SANDS OF TIME AS YOU CHANGE THE FACE OF
TECHNOLOGY IN THE COURSE OF THE WAY YOU WORK OVER THE
20 NEXT YEARS TO COME.
IN SOME WAYS IT IS SO EASY AND IN SOME WAYS IT'S
21 HARD.
BUT YOU WILL LEAVE YOUR FOOTPRINTS ON THE SANDS OF
22 TIME.
WHEN I THINK ABOUT MY MOTHER HANDING ME THAT
23 BROCHURE, I THINK IT WOULD HAVE BEEN SO EASY FOR HER
WHEREVER SHE PICKED IT UP TO LOOK AT IT AND THINK,
24 YOU KNOW, WE DON'T HAVE MONEY FOR LIFT TICKETS AND
CONDOS AND THROW IT AWAY.
25 WE DON'T HAVE SNOW IN SAN DIEGO.
LWE'RE BLACK, WE DON'T EVEN LIKE COLD WEATHER, RIGHT?

19

1 (LAUGHTER) THAT'S RIGHT UP THERE WITH WE
DON'T GOLF.
2 MY MOTHER WAS A WOMAN WHO DARED TO DREAM, WHO DARED
TO TAKE ON THINGS THAT OTHER PEOPLE MIGHT THINK
3 RIDICULOUS AND MAKE THEM REAL.
AND THAT WAS MY LEGACY.
4 THAT WAS WHAT I INHERITED.
BETTER THAN ALL THE SILVER AND GOLD, A SOUL THAT
5 ALLOWS ME TO DREAM TO MAKE THE WORLD A BETTER PLACE.
IN THE POST-SEPTEMBER 11 WORLD, WE MUST ALL STAY
6 FOCUSED ON BUILDING A WORLD THAT WE WANT AND NOT
GETTING CAUGHT UP NECESSARILY IN BELIEFS ABOUT THINGS
7 THAT ARE IN FRONT OF US, NOT GETTING CAUGHT UP IN THE
FEAR, NOT GETTING CAUGHT UP IN BELIEVING WHAT THEY
8 WANT US TO BELIEVE BUT IN KNOWING WHAT'S IN OUR
HEARTS AND OUR SOULS AS AMERICANS THAT WE CAN DO AND
9 BE.
THE REALITY IS IN US, IN OUR HEARTS.
10 IT'S NOT IN THE TECHNOLOGY, IT'S NOT IN LIMITATIONS,
IT'S IN OUR ABILITY TO DREAM THAT THE WORLD IS
11 CREATED.
I WENT TO THE OLYMPICS IN 1984.
12 I HAD TRAINED FOR SO MANY YEARS, SKIED IN 50 DEGREE
BELOW WEATHER WITH A 50 MILE AN HOUR WIND, WAITED
13 TABLES, BROKEN MY ANGLE, HAD STITCHES IN MY FACE, I
HAD GONE THROUGH ALL KINDS OF THINGS JUST TO MAKE IT
14 TO BE ON THE U.S. TEAM, TO BE REPRESENTING MY COUNTRY
SKIING IN THE PARALIMPICS IN AUSTRIA.
15 MY DREAM WAS JUST TO MAKE THE TEAM AND GO, NOT
NECESSARILY WINNING.
16 AND THEN MY MOTHER CAME ALONG WITH ME TO WATCH ME
SKI.
17 SHE HAD NEVER SEEN ME RACE BEFORE.
WE DIDN'T HAVE MONEY FOR HER TO FLY OFF TO COLORADO
18 AND MONTANA AND OTHER THINGS.
SO FINALLY FOR THE OLYMPICS SHE MANAGED TO GET TO GO
19 AND WATCH ME RACE FOR THE VERY FIRST TIME.
THE OTHER THING YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND ABOUT MY
20 MOTHER IS SHE DOESN'T REALLY GET IT WITH SPORTS,
OKAY?
21 SHE'S A SCHOOL TEACHER.
AND SHE'LL SEE A JOGGER ON THE STREET AND SAY CAN'T
22 THEY DO SOMETHING CONSTRUCTIVE?
SHE DOESN'T REALLY GET IT WITH SPORTS.
23 BUT HERE WE WERE, THERE WERE OVER 5A ATHLETES FROM 33
DIFFERENT COUNTRIES ALL COMPETING TO SEE WHO WAS THE
24 BEST OF THE BEST AND I CAME DOWN AFTER THE FIRST RUN,
I GOT TO THE BOTTOM OF THE HILL, AND THEY PUT MY NAME
25 AT THE VERY TOP OF THE RESULTS.
I WAS IN THE FIRST PLACE IN THE ENTIRE WORLD.

20

1 MY MOTHER WENT BERSERK.
SHE WAS JUMPING UP AND DOWN SCREAMING, "I GET IT.
2 IT'S ABOUT WINNING!"
(LAUGHTER) MY BROTHER ACTUALLY ROLLED HER
3 IN THE SNOW TO COOL HER OFF.
SHE WAS MAKING ME NERVOUS SO I HAD TO GET OUT OF
4 THERE.
IT TAKES TWO RUNS COMBINED TIME TO RUN A MEDAL.
5 SO I WENT BACK TO THE TOP TO MAKE MY SECOND RUN.
AND I HEARD A RUMOR THERE WAS A BAD PATCH OF ICE ON
6 THE RUN, A BAD RUT.
I'M THINKING NO HEROICS, I JUST NEED TO HAVE A GOOD
7 SOLID RUN.
SO I GET IN THE STARTINGIGATE GATE, THE TIMER IS
8 GOING 5, 4, 3,... PUSH OFF AND I'M GOING DOWN THE
HILL HITTING THE RED AND THE BLUE BAMBOO POLES.
9 I WAS SO FOCUSED I COULDN'T EVEN HEAR THE CROWD
SCREAMING.
10 THERE WAS A LOT OF PEOPLE SCREAMING MY NAME BECAUSE I
HAD BEEN SPONSORED BY THE NATIONAL BROTHERHOOD OF
11 SKIERS FOR MANY YEARS.
HAS ANYBODY HEARD OF THE NATIONAL BROTHERHOOD OF
12 SKIERS? IT'S A NATIONAL AFRICAN AMERICAN SKI
ORGANIZATION.
13 YES, WE DO LIKE COLD WEATHER.
AND 30 MEMBERS HAD SIGNED UP TO GO WITH ME AND WATCH
14 ME SKI AND CHEER ME ON.
HERE WE ARE IN EUROPE AND THERE'S THIS HUGE CROWD OF
15 SCREAMING BLACK PEOPLE ON THE HILL AND MY TEAMMATES
WOULD LOOK AT THEM AND LOOK AT ME, AND SAY, "BONNIE,
16 YOU HAVE A REALLY BIG FAMILY."
(LAUGHTER) AND I WOULD SAY YES, I DO.
17 BUT I WAS SO FOCUSED ON THIS RUN, THE POSSIBILITY I
MIGHT WIN THE GOLD, I COULD NOT EVEN HEAR THIS CROWD
18 OF PEOPLE SCREAMING MY NAME.
AND I'M GOING DOWN AND GOING DOWN AND I GET TO WHERE
19 I CAN SEE THE FINISH LINE AND I THINK I MADE IT, I'M
GOING TO WIN AND I HIT THE ICE.
20 I FOOT STARTED TO WOBBLE, I TRIED TO DIG IN AND HOLD
ON TO MY EDGE BUT I COULDN'T DO IT.
21 AND WHAM, I WAS ON MY TAIL IN THE SNOW.
HAVE YOU EVER SCREWED UP IN PUBLIC WHEN EVERYBODY'S
22 WATCHING?
GOVERNMENT IS LIKE THAT, ISN'T IT?
23 (LAUGHTER).
SEEMS LIKE THEY ALWAYS REPORT THE THINGS
24 THAT GO WRONG AND NOT THE THINGS THAT GO RIGHT, DON'T
THEY?
25 I WAS SO EMBARRASSED.
YOU KNOW I JUST WANTED TO CRAWL AWAY, NOT TO HAVE TO

21

1 GO BACK AND FACE MY MOTHER, MY FAMILY, MY FRIENDS, MY
SPONSORS, BUT BEFORE I EVEN KNEW WHAT WAS HAPPENING I
2 WAS BACK UP AND IN THE GATE.
MY REFLEXES WERE JUST TO GET BACK IN THE GATE AND GET
3 OVER THE FINISH LINE.
AND WHEN THE DUST CLEARED AND THE TIMES WERE ALL IN,
4 I WAS STILL IN THIRD PLACE.
IT TURNED OUT ALL THE TOP WOMEN ON ONE LEG HIT THE
5 SAME RUT, GOT DOWN AND GOT UP AND DID THE SAME THING
I DID.
6 SO I WAS STILL IN THE RUNNING.
I WAS ABLE TO STAND ON THE WINNER'S PODIUM, HAVE THE
7 BRONZE MEDAL PUT ON MY NECK, MY MOTHER SOBBING IN THE
SNOW.
8 IT WAS A GREAT MOMENT.
BUT IT WOULDN'T HAVE HAPPENED IF I HADN'T GOTTEN UP
9 AND GOTTEN OVER THE FINISH LINE.
THE WOMAN WHO WON THE GOLD IN THAT RACE HAD ALSO
10 FALLEN DOWN AND GOTTEN UP, AND I THOUGHT ABOUT THAT
AND I REALIZED I SKIED FASTER THAN HER, I SKIED
11 SLOLAM FASTER THAN HER.
PROBABLY RIGHT UP TO THE FRONT WHEN I FELL. AND I
12 SUDDENLY REALIZED SHE BEAT ME NOT BY SKIING FASTER
BUT BY GETTING UP FASTER.
13 SHE MUST NOT HAVE HAD THAT SPLIT SECOND OF FEELING
SORRY FOR HERSELF THAT I HAD AND SHE JUST GOT UP
14 WITHOUT HESITATION AND GOT OVER THE FINISH LINE.
SO I REALIZED PEOPLE FALL DOWN; WINNERS ARE THE
15 PEOPLE WHO GET UP AND SOMETIMES THE GOLD MEDAL WINNER
IS JUST THE PERSON WHO GOT UP THE FASTEST.
16 AS YOU PROCEED WITH THE IMPLEMENTATION OF SECTION
508, YOU WILL GET KNOCKED DOWN MANY TIMES.
17 THERE WILL BE THINGS THAT ARE DIFFICULT, CONFUSEING,
THERE WILL BE PROBLEMS THAT CROP UP,
18 MISUNDERSTANDINGS, BUT GETTING TO THE VISION JUST
REQUIRES GETTING UP.
19 SOMETIMES IT MAKES ALL THE DIFFERENCE WHEN WE CAN GET
UP A LITTLE FASTER.
20 I KNOW YOU'RE GOING TO ENJOY THE CONFERENCE AND
YOU'RE GOING TO FIND SO MANY TOOLS AND IDEAS AND
21 INFORMATION HERE THAT WILL ALLOW YOU TO MOVE FORWARD
TO EXPAND YOUR VISION OF YOUR ROLE IN THIS PROCESS.
22 AND ULTIMATELY WHEN THINGS GET TOUGH YOU'LL FIND
RESOURCES, PEOPLE, NETWORKS, AND SUPPORT HERE THAT
23 WILL HELP YOU TO GET UP A LITTLE FASTER.
I SALUTE YOU, THE HEROES OF 508.
24 THANKS.
(APPLAUSE)
25 >> THANK YOU VERY MUCH, BONNIE.
I ALSO HAVE ANOTHER SMALL TOKEN OF OUR APPRECIATION

22

1 TO PRESENT YOU FOR THAT VERY INSPIRING SPEECH.
>> THANK YOU.
2 >> I WAS REALLY IMPRESSED.
>> THANK YOU.
3 >> I THINK WE'VE HAD A VERY GOOD BEGINNING
AND NOW LET ME HAND IT OFF TO TERRY WEAVER TO MOVE IT
4 INTO THE MIDDLE.
>> GOOD MORNING.
5 MY NAME'S TERRY WEAVER, I'M THE DIRECTOR FOR THE
CENTER OF IT ACCOMMODATIONS AND I'D LIKE TO WELCOME
6 YOU ALL HERE TOO TODAY.
I'M THRILLED TO SEE SO MANY FACES AND I HAVE
7 BASICALLY A COUPLE OF KEY IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENTS TO
MAKE; THAT'S MY ROLE.
8 BUT I ALSO WANT TO THANK OUR SPEAKERS THIS MORNING.
A LOT OF WHAT CONFERENCES ARE, IN FACT ALL WHAT A
9 CONFERENCE IS ABOUT IS TWO THINGS, IT'S ABOUT
INSPIRATION, IS AND IT'S ABOUT INFORMATION, AND THIS
10 MORNING WE'VE HAD MANY INSPIRING THOUGHTS BOTH FOR
BON AND HE JENNIFER.
11 I KNOW EVERYBODY HERE IS GETTING GEARED UP.
I ALSO WANT TO THANK A HUGE TEAM THAT'S MADE THE
12 IDEAS CONFERENCE POSSIBLE THIS YEAR.
WE HAD A LOT OF SPONSORING AGENCIES AND THAT'S THE
13 DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE, THE DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE,
HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES, TRANSPORTATION AND
14 TREASURY, AND SOMEBODY I'M MISSING I'M NOT SURE.
AND MANY VOLUNTEERS FROM THOSE AGENCIES AND OTHER
15 AGENCIES.
YOU SEE PEOPLE WALKING AROUND WITH RED RIBBONS, THESE
16 PEOPLE ARE VOLUNTEERING TO HELP WITH THIS CONFERENCE
TODAY.
17 SO ALL OUR VOLUNTEERS AND TO THE SPONSORS, THANK YOU
VERY MUCH FOR THIS HARD WORK.
18 A FEW ADMINISTRATIVE THINGS HERE.
ONE THING I WANT TO LET YOU KNOW WE HAVE IN THE
19 INFORMATION PART WHERE YOU GET YOUR INFORMATION IS IN
THE WORKSHOPS.
20 YOU HAVE YOUR AGENDAS.
SOME OF YOU HAVE SIGNED UP FOR WORKSHOPS THAT ARE
21 OVERFILLED BUT WE'RE READY FOR THAT.
WE HAVE AN OVERFLOW ROOM.
22 AND ONE OF OUR VOLUNTEERS WILL HELP YOU FIND THEM
OUTSIDE BY THE REGISTRATION DESK AREA.
23 SO IF YOU'RE IN A WORKSHOP AND THERE'S NO SPACE IN
THAT AREA, PLEASE GO TO THE OVERFLOW ROOM AND YOU'LL
24 BE ABLE TO HEAR AND SHARE THE INFORMATION THAT'S IN
THE WORKSHOP.
25 AND I'M GLAD YOU'RE ALL GOING TO BE HERE IN THE
WORKSHOPS TODAY AND TOMORROW.

23

1 I BELIEVE THE NEXT STAGE OF OUR PROGRAM IS GOING TO
BE THE RIBBON CUTTING CEREMONY IN OUR EXHIBIT AREA
2 AND I THINK WE'RE A LITTLE BIT OF AHEAD.
OPHELIA, ARE WE DOING OKAY WITH THAT?
3 I'M A LITTLE AHEAD.
I THINK THAT'S --
4 >> 30 MINUTES.
>> IN 30 MINUTES THE RIBBON CUTTING
5 CEREMONY OVER IN THE EXHIBIT AREA, SO AS -- YOU HAVE
A LITTLE BIT OF PAUSE TO REFRESH YOURSELVES AND USE
6 ALL THE NECESSARY ROOMS AND SUCH.
AND AGAIN, TALK WITH EACH OTHER, I THINK WE'VE BEEN
7 CHALLENGED TODAY TO TALK TO EACH OTHER AND SHARE
IDEAS.
8 I KNOW -- SAW A LOT OF GOOD DIALOGUE GOING ON HERE.
IF YOU HAVE IDEAS, I'M USING THAT WITH A SMALL I,
9 ABOUT WHERE WE CAN GO AS A GOVERNMENT AND THINGS YOU
WANT TO SHARE, WE HAVE LOTS OF DIFFERENT VEHICLES OUT
10 THERE TO HELP YOU WITH THAT AND I'M GOING TO GIVE YOU
A WEB PAGE, WWW.SECTION 508.GOV.
11 THERE'S ACTUALLY A QUESTIONS AND COMMENTS BUTTON ON
THAT AS WELL AS A WEALTH OF MADAM FOREMANATION ABOUT
12 SECTION 508.
BUT YOU CAN ALSO SUBMIT QUESTIONS, CONCERNS, IDEAS TO
13 US.
SO THIS IS NOT THE ONLY TIME YOU ARE GOING TO GET TO
14 DIALOGUE.
IF YOU ARE LOOKING TO TALK, GIVE IDEAS, SUGGESTIONS,
15 PLEASE, WE HAVE LOTS OF ABILITY TO HEAR THAT.
THERE'S A NETWORK OF PEOPLE INVOLVED IN SUPPORTING
16 THAT. MY STAFF IS COMPLETELY DEVOTED TO 508 AND WE
WANT TO HEAR FROM YOU.
17 THANK YOU FOR THIS TIME THIS MORNING AND WE'LL SEE
YOU IN AN EXHIBIT AREA IN HALF AN HOUR.
18 WE'RE A LITTLE BIT LATE IN GETTING STARTED.
LET ME GIVE YOU A HANDOUT.............
19 .
.
20 .
.
21 .
.
22 .
.
23 .
.
24 .
:
25 .
.

24

1 .
.
2 .
.
3 >>THEY'RE STILL TESTING.
NO?
4 >> OKAY.
ACTUALLY YOU KNOW THIS IS BEING WEB CAST AND SO I CAN
5 SEE THE PEOPLE -- SO OKAY.
WE'RE SEEING A BLURRY PICTURE.
6 THE LAW SAYS THAT WHEN AGENCIES DEVELOP, PROCURE,
MAINTAIN, OR USE ELECTRONIC TECHNOLOGY AND ELECTRONIC
7 EITHER AGENCY OR DEPARTMENT, INCLUDING THE
UNITED STATES POST OFFICE SHALL ENSURE UNLESS AN
8 UNDUE BURDEN WOULD BE IMPOSED ON THE DEPARTMENT OR
AGENCY THAT THE ELECTRONIC INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY
9 ALLOWS REGARDLESS OF THE TYPE OF MEDIUM OF THE
TECHNOLOGY, EQUAL ACCESS OF EMPLOYEES OF THE
10 GOVERNMENT TO THE INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY WHO HAVE
DISABILITIES AND ACCESS OF THE PUBLIC WHEN A MEMBER
11 OF THE PUBLIC HAS A DISABILITY, THEY HAVE THE SAME
RIGHT TO INFORMATION ACCESS PUT OUT BY THE GOVERNMENT
12 AS A PERSON WITHOUT A DISABILITY.
AND OF COURSE THIS IS HOW WE GOT INTO THE WEB.
13 SO THAT IN A NUTSHELL IS 508.
508 IS A SET OF STANDARDS WRITTEN BY THE BOARD, IT
14 HAS BEEN VETTED THROUGH SEVERAL PROCESSES BOTH WITHIN
THE GOVERNMENT AND A PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD AND IT IS
15 IMPLEMENTING A PIECE OF LEGISLATION THAT MANDATES
THAT WHEN THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT -- AND IT IS
16 RESTRICTED AT THIS POINT TO THE EXECUTIVE DEPARTMENTS
AND AGENCIES, IT DOES NOT COVER THE LIBRARY OF
17 CONGRESS OR THE HILL IN GENERAL.
HOWEVER, WE'RE SEEING A VERY STRONG INTEREST ON THE
18 HILL OF PEOPLE WANTING TO COMPLY.
BUT THE IDEA IS THAT YOU DON'T GO OUT AND JUST BUY
19 TECHNOLOGY AND THEN FIGURE OUT LATER, HUH, GOT A
PERSON WITH A DISABILITY, WONDER HOW WE'RE GOING TO
20 GET THEM TO WORK ON THIS.
YOU DO IT AHEAD OF TIME.
21 WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO DO IS JUST TAKE A
SECOND AND WHAT I WOULD SAY INVENTORY THE AUDIENCE,
22 BECAUSE WE GIVE SO MANY PRESENTATIONS LIKE THIS, JUST
WORKING ON MY END OF THE YEAR REPORT THAT MY BOSS
23 REQUIRES THE MIDDLE OF EACH OCTOBER, AND ROUGHLY I'VE
DONE ABOUT 65 OF THESE SINCE JANUARY.
24 NOW, I KNOW I'M TALKING TO THE SAME PEOPLE SOMETIMES.
AND I'M WONDERING WHETHER IT'S THAT I'M THAT EXCITING
25 OR THEY'RE WAITING FOR ME TO SAY SOMETHING IMPORTANT.
ALL RIGHT.

25

1 HOW MANY OF YOU HAVE A KNOWLEDGE, IF YOU JUST RAISE
YOUR HAND, KEN IS GOING TO DO MY AUDIO DESCRIPTION.
2 HOW MANY OF YOU HAVE SOME FAMILIARITY WITH 508?
>> THAT'S EVERYONE.
3 >> EVERYONE.
HOW COME YOU'RE HERE?
4 (LAUGHTER) HOW MANY OF YOU ARE DIRECTLY
INVOLVED IN PROCUREMENT OR ARE REQUIRING OFFICIALS
5 WHERE YOU HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO TELL PROCUREMENT I
WISH TO BUY THIS OR THAT PRODUCT?
6 >> LESS THAN 5%.
>> LESS THAN 5%.
7 ALL RIGHT.
WE WON'T GET INTO PROCUREMENT LAW.
8 HOW MANY OF YOU ARE IN THE AREA OF IT, THAT IS
INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY?
9 80%.
90%, I THOUGHT I WAS GOING TO TALK TO HUMAN RESOURCE
10 PEOPLE.
THAT GETS SCARY.
11 OKAY.
AND I'M NOT INSULTING HUMAN RESOURCE PEOPLE, GOOD
12 HEAVENS.
SO WHAT WE WANT TO TALK ABOUT THEN IS I WANT TO TALK
13 VERY SPECIFICALLY ABOUT WHAT ARE THE 508 STANDARDS.
WHAT IS IT THAT WE HAVE ACTUALLY SAID THAT YOU AS
14 TECHNICAL PEOPLE HAVE TO DEAL WITH?
IF YOU'RE IN IT, YOU'RE IN A SITUATION WHERE YOU'RE
15 GOING TO BE INTERACTING WITH THIS EQUIPMENT AND SOME
OF THE EQUIPMENT MAY CHANGE IN THE NEXT TWO TO THREE
16 YEARS AND YOU'RE GOING TO -- WELL, I'LL MAKE A
PREDICTION.
17 YOUR LIFE IS GOING TO GET EASIER.
BECAUSE IN GENERAL WHAT OUR STANDARDS DO IS PUSH FOR
18 A MUCH MORE COMPATIBLE, OPEN ARCHITECTURE THAT WILL
HOPEFULLY ELIMINATE A LOT OF THE CLASHES, THE
19 INABILITIY PROBLEMS THAT YOU RUN INTO WHEN YOU BUY
FROM DIFFERENT VENDORS AND SO ON BECAUSE WE'RE
20 SETTING A STANDARD MEET MEET PLACE.
THAT STANDARD MEETING PLACE IS ASSISTIVE TECHNOLOGY.
21 WE ARE NOT SAYING IN THE RULE THAT YOU HAVE TO HAVE A
SPEECH OUTPUT SYSTEM, A SPECIALIZED KEYBOARD, A
22 BRAILLE DISPLAY, AND LARGE PRINT ON EVERY MACHINE YOU
BUY FROM NOW ON.
23 WHAT WE ARE SAYING IS THAT YOU HAVE TO BE COMPATIBLE,
WELL, YOU DON'T, THE MACHINE YOU BUY HAS TO BE
24 COMPATIBLE WITH THAT TYPE OF EQUIPMENT.
SO THAT WE MAY BUY OR JUSTICE MAY BUY A PIECE OF
25 EQUIPMENT AND IT'S GOING TO BE PUT ON KEN MCCADDA
FROM THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE WHO IS BESIDE ME OR IT

26

1 MAY BE PUT ON THE DESK OF TERRY WEAVER FROM GSA.
TERRY IS HEAD OF THE CENTER FOR IT ACCOMMODATIONS.
2 NOW, AS FAR AS I KNOW, NEITHER ONE OF THEM NEED
SPECIAL ACCOMMODATIONS.
3 AND I WON'T MAKE A WISE CRACK, I PROMISE.
HOWEVER, WHAT IF KEN DECIDES THAT HE GETS A BETTER
4 OFFER AND ANOTHER LAWYER COMES IN WHO KNOWS, IT MIGHT
BE MY BROTHER, WHO ALSO DOESN'T SEE, AND ALL OF A
5 SUDDEN HE WANTS TO USE SOME EQUIPMENT THAT WILL MAKE
KEN'S MACHINE ACCESSIBLE TO HIM.
6 WHAT GYRATIONS WILL YOU AS IT PEOPLE HAVE TO GO
THROUGH TO ATTACH AND MAKE THAT EQUIPMENT WORK?
7 AND WILL THE SOFTWARE THAT YOU ARE RUNNING ON KEN'S
MACHINE NOW RUN ON MY BROTHER'S MACHINE?
8 IF 508 DOES ITS JOB WELL, IF THE BOARD DID ITS JOB
WELL, THEN YES, IT WILL BE A PIECE OF CAKE.
9 IT WILL BE A MATTER OF INSTALLING AND CONNECTING AND
AWAY YOU G. THERE SHOULDN'T BE A GREAT DEAL OF HASSLE
10 WITH LOOKING FOR SUCH THINGS AS INTERRUPTS OR DIRECT
MEMORY ACCESS BUT EVEN MORE IMPORTANTLY THE SOFTWARE
11 HOPEFULLY WILL HAVE BUILT INTO IT THE ABILITY TO WITH
GRAPHICS AND TEXT ALERT THE USER WHO WANTS TO WATCH
12 THE GRAPHICS, WHAT IS GOING ON, AND ALERT THE USER
WHO IS USING A SYSTEM THAT CAN ONLY READ TEXT WHAT IS
13 HAPPENING.
AND WHAT DO I MEAN BY THIS?
14 FOR EXAMPLE, IN OUR SOFTWARE STANDARDS WE ACTUALLY
ADDRESS THE NOTION THAT WHEN YOU HAVE PROGRAM
15 ELEMENTS -- SOMEBODY ASKED ME WHAT'S A PROGRAM
ELEMENT.
16 I TOLD THEM IT'S AN ELEMENT OF A PROGRAM.
SORRY, I CAN'T RESIST SOMETIMES; IT'S JUST TERRIBLE.
17 MY FATHER TOLD ME I'D NEVER LEARN TO SHUT UP.
ANYWAY, WE SAY THAT SUFFICIENT INFORMATION OF A USER
18 INTERFACE ELEMENT INCLUDING THE IDENTITY, OPERATION,
AND STATE THE ELEMENT SHOULD BE AVAILABLE.
19 WHAT THIS MEANS IS AVAILABLE IN TEXT.
WHAT DOES ALL THIS MEAN?
20 VERY SIMPLE.
IT MEANS THAT WHEN YOU HAVE A CHECK BOX OR A BUTTON,
21 IS IT PRESSED OR NOT PRESSED?
AND IF YOU PRESS IT, WHAT WILL IT DO?
22 THIS IS THE SORT OF INFORMATION THAT HAS BEEN
DISPLAYED VISUALLY.
23 WHEN I FIRST LEARNED ABOUT WINDOWS, THERE'S SOME VERY
UNUSUAL CONCEPTS.
24 I WAS TALKING TO A VERY GOOD PROGRAMMER AND HE SAID,
"THOMAS, HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT THAT IS THE DEFAULT
25 NUMBER?
HOW DO YOU KNOW YOU'RE TO PRESS THAT ONE?" HE SAID,

27

1 "BECAUSE IT LOOKS LIKE IT WANTS TO BE PRESSED."
THAT WAS KIND OF MIND-BOGGLING TO ME.
2 HOW YOU GET A BUTTON THAT LOOKS LIKE IT WANTS TO BE
PRESSED.
3 BUT IN ORDER TO MAKE THAT SAME BUTTON USABLE FOR
SOMEBODY WHO CANNOT SEE THE BUTTON THEN YOU NEED TO
4 ADD SOME TEXT.
AND ALL THE POPULAR SCREEN READING EQUIPMENT, ALL THE
5 SCREEN ENLARGEMENT EQUIPMENT WILL INDICATE WHAT IS
THE DEFAULT.
6 WHAT'LL HAPPEN IF YOU JUST FOR INSTANCE HIT THE ENTER
KEY.
7 SO THESE ARE THE TYPES OF FUNCTIONS THAT WE ARE
REQUIRING ALL SOFTWARE TO FOLLOW.
8 NOW, QUESTIONS THAT I GET ASKED ABOUT LIKE SOFTWARE,
WE DON'T HAVE ANY DISABLED PEOPLE IN OUR AGENCY.
9 MUST BE A VERY SMALL AGENCY.
MAYBE IT'S THE HELIUM COMMISSION.
10 BUT THE POINT IS ARE YOU GOING TO HIRE SOMEBODY WITH
A DISABILITY IN TWO YEARS?
11 WELL, WE DON'T HAVE ANY WAY OF KNOWING THAT.
IF YOU HIRE SOMEBODY IN TWO YEARS, ARE YOU GOING TO
12 THEN REDO YOUR WHOLE INFRASTRUCTURE BECAUSE YOU
DIDN'T FOLLOW IT THE FIRST TIME?
13 WELL GOLLY GEE.
SO 508 AND THE FOLLOWING OF THESE CRITERIA ARE NOT AT
14 ALL DEPENDENT ON THE INTENDED COMMUNITY OR AUDIENCE
WITHIN YOUR AGENCY.
15 YOU MUST FOLLOW THEM IF YOU HAVE NO EMPLOYEES.
SUCH THINGS AS SOFTWARE THAT'S DESIGNED TO RUN ON A
16 KEYBOARD -- NOT ON A KEYBOARD, I'M SORRY, RUN ON A
SYSTEM WHERE THERE IS A KEYBOARD, YOU NEED TO PROVIDE
17 FUNCTIONAL KEY STROKES.
THAT IS HIT A KEY STROKE TO ACCOMPLISH SOMETHING THAT
18 CAN BE ACCOMPLISHED WITH A PROGRAM SUCH AS SAVE A
FILE, PRINT, ALL OF THAT SORT OF STUFF.
19 THE ONLY TIME YOU DON'T HAVE TO DO THAT IS WHEN YOU
HAVE A DRAWING PROGRAM AND THERE'S NO WAY TO IN ANY
20 OTHER MEANS BUT STRICTLY VISUAL TO INDICATE WHAT
YOU'RE ABOUT TO DO AND TO INDICATE THE RESULTS OF
21 WHAT YOU DID.
WE TALK ABOUT HOW TO FOCUS.
22 FOCUS IS WHERE SOMETHING'S GOING TO HAPPEN IF YOU
CLICK.
23 AND WE TALK ABOUT THE FACT THAT FIRST THAT MUST BE
VISUALLY APPARENT AND THAT WILL MAKE LIFE EASIER FOR
24 EVERYBODY.
I'LL SAY -- I'LL BE TALKING TO SOMEBODY, I'LL SAY
25 NOW, WHEN I HIT THE END KEY, WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN?
WELL, I CAN'T SEE... IT'S NOT CLEAR.

28

1 I HOPE THOSE SITUATIONS GO AWAY.
BECAUSE WE NEED A CLEAR FOCUS ON THE SCREEN AS TO
2 WHERE THE INPUT POINT IS GOING TO BE, BUT THAT FOCUS
WITHIN THE PROGRAM ITSELF MUST BE AVAILABLE SO THAT
3 OTHER TECHNOLOGIES SUCH AS VOICE INPUT AND VOICE
OUTPUT KNOW WHERE THE INFORMATION IS GOING TO GO.
4 THAT'S ONE OF THOSE THINGS THAT, BELIEVE ME, IS GOING
TO MAKE LIFE EASIER FOR EVERYBODY, BECAUSE THAT WILL
5 MAKE PROGRAMS RUN QUITE A BIT SMOOTHER.
WE ACTUALLY HAVE SEVERAL SECTIONS.
6 I'VE BEEN DWELLING ON SOFTWARE AND I'VE BEEN DOING IT
FOR A REASON.
7 EVERY TIME I HIT THE WEB SECTION WE NEVER GET ANY
FURTHER.
8 WE HAVE A SECTION ON TELECOMMUNICATIONS PRODUCTS.
AND THEN MEANS PHONES, CELL PHONES, ANYTHING WITH A
9 TELECOMMUNICATIONS FUNCTION.
WE ALSO HAVE MULTIMEDIA WHICH COVERS PRODUCTIONS NO
10 MATTER WHAT THE MEDIUM IS.
MULTIMEDIA PRODUCTIONS.
11 NOW, MULTIMEDIA PRODUCTION IS A PRODUCTION THAT'S
USING MORE THAN ONE MEDIA.
12 I'M NOT BEING FLIP.
I WAS ASKED THAT ONCE.
13 WHAT IS A MULTIMEDIA PRODUCTION?
IT'S A MEDIA THAT USES GENERALLY SOUND AND VISUAL.
14 A WEB CAST IS A SINGLE MEDIA PRODUCTION.
THEREFORE, THAT'S IMPORTANT BECAUSE WE DON'T REQUIRE
15 THAT TO BE CAPTIONED.
YOU DO HAVE TO HAVE A SCRIPT OR ALTERNATIVE TEXT, BUT
16 IF IT'S AUDIO, YOU DON'T HAVE TO SYNCINIZE IT BECAUSE
THERE'S NO VISUAL TO SYNCHRONIZE THE CAPTIONING WITH.
17 [] THEN WE HAVE A CATEGORY THAT I REALLY SHOULD HAVE
HAD A CONTEST, A NAMING CONTEST.
18 IT IS CALLED SELF CONTAINED CLOSED SYSTEMS.
WELL, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE'RE SUPPOSED
19 TO DO, AND I WILL ADMIT IT HAS BECOME ONE OF MY LEAST
FAVORITE REGULATIONS, WE ARE SUPPOSED TO WRITE IN
20 PLAIN ENGLISH.
SO WHEN I SAY SELF-CONTAINED CLOSED PRODUCTS, I GET
21 JUMPED ALL OVER.
"WHAT IS THAT?" WHAT DO YOU THINK IT IS?
22 IT'S SORT OF LIKE AN INFORMATION KIOSK OR COPIER OR
SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
23 I SAY YOU'RE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT.
THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH OUR CATEGORY HEADING
24 BECAUSE EVERYBODY GETS IT.
BUT THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT IT IS.
25 IT IS THESE SYSTEMS WHERE YOU CANNOT REQUIRE AN
INDIVIDUAL TO CARRY AROUND THEIR OWN ASSISTIVE

29

1 EQUIPMENT.
THERE THE ACCESS FEATURES MUST BE BUILT IN.
2 I HAVE BEEN VERY SURPRISED.
I'VE BEEN DOING A LOT OF PRESENTATIONS AND A LOT OF
3 E-MAIL AND SO ON WITH COPIER MANUFACTURERS.
AND I'M INCLUDING OSAA, HP, CANON, RICOH, AND OF ALL
4 THE DIFFERENT GROUPS OF PRODUCTS, I'LL TELL YOU THOSE
GUYS ARE RIGHT OUT THERE IN THE FOREFRONT.
5 THEY SEE IT AS A WAY TO INCREASE THEIR
COMPETITIVENESS AND I THOUGHT COPIERS WOULD BE
6 PROBABLY THESE LARGE NETWORK-TYPE COPIERS WOULD BE
THE LAST TO BITE THE BULLET FOR 508 BECAUSE THEY'RE
7 THE ONES THAT MAY HAVE TO ACTUALLY DO SOME, YOU KNOW,
RETOOLING.
8 BUT THEY'RE GOING GUNG HO.
AND THEN WE HAVE SOME VERY STRAIGHTFORWARD TECHNICAL
9 REQUIREMENTS FOR THE PC'S AND DESKTOPS.
JUST THE BOX.
10 NOW, KEEP IN MIND THAT ANY ITEM, ANY PRODUCT MAY
ACTUALLY FALL UNDER SEVERAL COMPONENTS.
11 WE HAVE HAD PROBLEMS GETTING THIS ACROSS.
SO I WILL SAY IT PROBABLY IN EVERY TALK NOW AND
12 YOU'RE GOING TO GET SO SICK OF IT.
LET'S TAKE A PALM TOP THAT LETS YOU GET E-MAIL AND
13 KEEP NOTES.
FIRST OF ALL, PALM TOPS ARE GENERALLY PRETTY CLOSED
14 SYSTEMS.
YEAH, THEY DO HAVE SLOTS YOU CAN PUT A MEMORY CARD IN
15 BUT THEY'RE REALLY NOT YET AT THE STAGE WHERE YOU
COULD ADD OTHER PROGRAMS AND ADD OTHER HARDWARE, SO I
16 WOULD STILL CLASSIFY THESE REAL TINY COMPUTERS AS
SELF-CONTAINED CLOSE SYSTEMS, MEANING THAT TO MAKE
17 THEM TRULY ACCESSIBLE THE ACCESSIBILITY FEATURES WILL
HAVE TO BE PUT IN.
18 NOW, IT HAS TELECOMMUNICATIONS CAPABILITIES, SO IT
ALSO COMES UNDER TELECOMMUNICATIONS.
19 FOR EXAMPLE, IT MUST BE CAPABILITY OF TRANSMITING THE
NORMAL SIGNALS THAT ARE REQUIRED BY A TTY.
20 IT ALSO WOULD USE SOFTWARE, SOFTWARE TO STORE NOTES,
RETRIEVE YOUR CALENDAR, AND THEREFORE, THE SOFTWARE
21 REQUIREMENTS APPLY FOR THE FOLKS DOING THE SOFTWARE.
AND IT'S VERY IMPORTANT TO THINK OF NOT PRODUCTS BUT
22 COMPONENTS.
NOW, ONE OTHER SECTION THAT'S KIND OF IMPORTANT THAT
23 HAS CAUSED SOME CONFUSION SO I WILL MENTION IT, OUR
PLAN IS TO, YOU KNOW, IF YOU'VE GOT BURNING QUESTIONS
24 NOW, WE'LL TACKLE THEM, BUT WE'RE EACH GOING TO TALK
FOR ABOUT 20 MINUTES.
25 KEN SCARED ME.
I THOUGHT I WAS GOING TO HAVE TO GO 40, ESPECIALLY

30

1 WITH NO MIKE.
BUT -- AND THEN FOR THE LAST HALF-HOUR WE WOULD LIKE
2 A GOOD OLD FASHIONED FREE FOR ALL IN TERMS OF
QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS.
3 I WANT TO MENTION DOCUMENTATION, KIND OF A HEATED
ISSUE.
4 WE HAVE A SECTION, VERY LAST SECTION OF OUR RULE AND
IT HAS THREE PARTS.
5 AND THE FIRST ONE BASICALLY SAYS THAT WHEN END USER
DOCUMENTATION IS -- OR WHEN DOCUMENTATION IS SUPPLIED
6 TO END USERS, IT MUST BE AVAILABLE ON REQUEST IN
ALTERNATIVE FORMATS.
7 SECOND, UPON REQUEST THERE SHOULD BE A DESCRIPTION OF
THE ACCESSIBILITY FEATURES THAT ARE IN A PRODUCT, AND
8 THIRD, IT SAYS THAT HELP DESK -- THESE ARE HELP DESKS
SUPPORTED BY THE GOVERNMENT -- MUST BE ABLE TO
9 ACCOMMODATE THE COMMUNICATION NEEDS OF ALL END USERS,
AND THIS RANGES FROM KNOWING HOW TO USE A TTY, HOW TO
10 ACCEPT A RELAY CALL, OR WHAT ARE THE KEYBOARD
FUNCTIONAL ALTERNATIVES IN, SAY, OUTLOOK EXPRESS?
11 BECAUSE THAT WOULD CERTAINLY BE MY COMMUNICATION
NEED.
12 HOW DO I DO SOMETHING FROM THE KEYBOARD?
AND BELIEVE ME, THERE ARE VERY FEW PEOPLE THAT REALLY
13 -- THERE ARE SOME REALLY CRACKER JACK USERS WHO CAN
RUN A PROGRAM FROM THE KEYBOARD BUT MOST PEOPLE ARE
14 VERY MOUSE DISABLED.
THE FIRST ONE IS VERY IMPORTANT.
15 END USER -- WHEN END END END DOCUMENTATION IS
SUPPLIED -- DIDN'T SAY END USER; IT SAID WHEN.
16 BECAUSE YOU DON'T PASS OUT THESE DAYS THE GIANT BOOKS
THAT WE USED TO GET WITH EVERY NEW PIECE OF SOFTWARE.
17 AND SO YOU DON'T HAVE TO SUPPLY THAT BIG BOOK IN AN
ALTERNATE FORMAT IF YOU DON'T SUPPLY IT TO ANYBODY.
18 ALSO IT IS NOT THE VENDOR'S RESPONSIBILITY TO SUPPLY
ALTERNATE FORMAT; IT'S THE AGENCY'S.
19 SO ANYTIME ANYBODY DOES A CONTRACT, AND I SAY THE
SAME THING TO INDUSTRY WITH JUST A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT
20 TWIST, ANYTIME YOU AS A GOVERNMENT AGENCY REQUIRES A
PRODUCT, YOU REQUIRE A PRODUCT, IT WOULD BEHOOVE YOU
21 TO PUT IN THAT RFP THAT YOU WOULD REQUEST AN
ELECTRONIC VERSION OF THE DOCUMENT CAPABLE OF BEING
22 CONVERTED SO THAT IT COULD BE PUT INTO HTML WHICH
WOULD BE AN ACCESSIBLE FORMAT OR COULD BE CONVERTED
23 INTO BRAILLE OR READ WITH A VOICE SYNTHESIZER.
SO I TELL THE MANUFACTURERS, IF YOU WANT TO MAKE LIFE
24 EASY FOR THE AGENCIES, IT WOULD BEHOOVE YOU TO OFFER
IN YOUR BID ALL YOUR DOCUMENTATION IN ELECTRONIC FORM
25 SO THAT THEY CAN MEET THEIR NEEDS.
I'M GOING TO STOP THERE.

31

1 ANY QUESTIONS BEFORE WE MOVE ON TO THE LEGAL SIDE OF
THINGS?
2 KEN SAID I DON'T WANT TO -- KEN SAID I DON'T KNOW
WHAT TO TALK ABOUT.
3 I SAID YOU COVER WHAT I DON'T.
Q. QUESTION.
4 YOU TALK ABOUT SO FOR EXAMPLE WHEN WE POST AN FILE
OR MICROSOFT WORD ON A WEB SITE, IS IT SUBJECT TO THE
5 SOFTWARE REQUIREMENTS OR THE AND THEN...
>> OKAY.
6 THE EXAMPLES YOU'VE GIVEN ALL REQUIRE FOR A PERSON TO
OPEN THAT DOCUMENT THAT THEY HAVE SOME SOFTWARE ON
7 THEIR COMPUTER; AM I RIGHT?
>> YEAH.
8 >> OKAY.
SO WHAT WE HAVE SAID HERE IS THAT WHEN IN THE WEB,
9 WHEN THE A DOCUMENT OR PAGE ON THE WEB REQUIRES AN
APPLICATION THAT A LINK MUST BE PROVIDED TO A
10 SOFTWARE PRODUCT THAT MEETS OUR SOFTWARE STANDARDS.
IN OTHER WORDS, YOU DON'T HAVE TO DO ANYTHING IN THIS
11 CASE FOR THE ONES YOU'VE MENTIONED.
AND YOU DIDN'T.
12 I SHOULD KEEP MY MOUTH SHUT, BUT YOU DIDN'T OPEN UP
THE FDF BOX, OR PAND PANDA'S BOX.
13 BUT NO, WORD WOULD BE CONSIDERED ACCESSIBLE BECAUSE
-- AND IF YOU CARRY THIS TO EXTREMES, YOU COULD SAY,
14 WELL, IF I PUT SOMETHING ON WORD, DOES THAT MEAN I
HAVE TO POINT TO WHERE SOMEBODY DOWNLOADS WORD?
15 YOU CAN POINT TO -- THERE ARE PLENTY OF WORD VIEWERS,
BUT AN AGENCY ISN'T LIKELY TO PUT A WORD DOCUMENT UP
16 AND ASSUME EVERYBODY OUT THERE IS USING WORD.
THERE MIGHT BE ONE OR TWO WORDPERFECT USERS.
17 BUT EVEN SO, WORDPERFECT WILL BRING UP A WORD
DOCUMENT.
18 AND BOTH OF THOSE PROGRAMS COME REASONABLY CLOSE TO
MEETING THE SOFTWARE STANDARDS AND THE SAME WITH THE
19 MPEG FILE.
YOU PUT UP AN MPEG FILE, IT'S GOING TO BE RUN BY
20 MAYBE WINDOWS MEDIA PLAYER OR MAYBE BY -- AND THOSE
ARE THE ONES THAT NEED TO THINK MORE SERIOUSLY BEING
21 508 COMPLAINT.
>> OKAY.
22 IN OTHER WORDS, -- OKAY.
LET ME ASK YOU A QUESTION.
23 WHAT ABOUT THEM?
AND I'M NOT BEING FLIP; WHAT ABOUT THEM?
24 >> (INAUDIBLE).
.
25 >> WHAT IT MEANS IS FIRST OF ALL THERE IS
NOT ON THE MARKET AT THIS TIME WHAT I WOULD CONSIDER

32

1 A FULLY ACCESSIBLE BLACK BERRY.
IT'S CERTAINLY ACCESSIBLE TO SOME PEOPLE [] SOME
2 PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES USE THEM A LOT.
BUT FOR CERTAIN DISABILITIES IT IS NOT ACCESSIBLE AT
3 THIS POINT.
AND NONE OF ITS COMPETITORS ARE.
4 SO YOU FALL INTO THE SITUATION WHERE YOU CAN GO AHEAD
AND PURCHASE IT BECAUSE THE TECHNOLOGY IS NOT THERE
5 YET TO MEET THE ACCESS NEEDS.
NOW, I GUARANTEE YOU THAT INDUSTRY IS LOOKING FOR
6 WAYS TO COMPETE IN THAT AREA TOO, AND THE TIME WILL
COME WHEN YOU WON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT THAT BECAUSE
7 THEY WILL HAVE ACCESS FEATURES BUILT IN.
BUT UNTIL THEY ARE, YOU DON'T HAVE TO BUY THEM.
8 WHAT IT MEANS, THE BASIC OF THIS LAW IS THAT YES, IT
WILL DRIVE THE MARKET SOME, BUT THE WHOLE IDEA IS
9 THAT IF THE ACCESS FEATURES ARE OUT THERE, DON'T
IGNORE THEM.
10 IF THEY'RE NOT OUT THERE, WE IN OUR GREAT WISDOM
DON'T REQUIRE YOU TO BUY SOMETHING THAT DOESN'T
11 EXIST.
>> SPECIFICALLY TELEPHONE SYSTEMS...
12 INAUDIBLE.
>> HAVE YOU -- WELL, I'M GOING TO TURN IT
13 OVER TO KEN.
(LAUGHTER).
14 BUT IN ALL HONESTY, THIS IS AN ISSUE FOR
THE FAR FOLKS.
15 I'M NOT DUCKING, I JUST I I WANT TO ANSWER A QUESTION
INCORRECTLY.
16 SO WE SORT OF HAVE AN AGREEMENT.
I DON'T ANSWER FAR QUESTIONS, FAR DOESN'T ANSWER
17 TECHNICAL QUESTIONS.
AND THIS IS DEFINITELY WHAT DO YOU DO ABOUT
18 MAINTENANCE.
AND IT COMES UP A LOT AND I SEND THEM RIGHT UP TO
19 LINDA NELSON AT GSA.
WHY DON'T I INTRODUCE KEN.
20 OKAY.
YOU'RE INTRODUCED.
21 HE'S A TRIAL ATTORNEY.
BEEN WITH THE CIVIL TRIAL DIVISION AND NOW FULL TIME
22 ON 508.
AND I SHOULDN'T TELL YOU THAT HE KNOWS PROBABLY MORE
23 ABOUT CODING ON THE WEB THAN ANYBODY ELSE IN THE ROOM
AS WELL AS BEING A LAWYER.
24 SO I WILL TURN IT OVER TO KEN
(APPLAUSE)
25 KEN: GOOD AFTERNOON, EVERYONE.
MY NAME IS KEN NACOTTA.

33

1 I'M ARN ATTORNEY AT THE TRIAL -- MY SIGN OVER HERE
SAYS MARY LOU MOBLEY.
2 THAT'S A COWORKER OF MINE.
I'M NOT MARY LOU.
3 ANYWAYS, YESTERDAY MARY LOU SUDDENLY HAD TO GO ON TO
ANOTHER MEETING TODAY AND SHE REALIZED THAT AND SO
4 HERE I AM.
AND SO EVEN IF I HAD ALL THE PREPARATION IN THE
5 WORLD, I DON'T KNOW WHETHER I WOULD HAVE ORGANIZED
THIS ANY DIFFERENTLY.
6 I'VE BEEN WORKING ON 508 FOR QUITE SOME TIME NOW
SINCE ABOUT 1998, AND DURING THAT TIME A LOT OF THESE
7 THINGS, IF YOU LIVE 508 AND EAT, DRINK, AND SLEEP
508, SOME THINGS BECOME KIND OF EASIER FOR YOU TO
8 UNDERSTAND JUST BECAUSE YOU HAVE TO DEAL WITH IT ALL
THE TIME.
9 AND SO A LOT OF THE THINGS THAT I JUST TAKE FOR
GRANTED A LOT OF PEOPLE REALLY DON'T TAKE FOR
10 GRANTED.
SO WHAT I THOUGHT I WOULD DO INSTEAD OF TRYING TO
11 GIVE SOME UBER OVERVIEW OF 508 IS TO TRY AND TALK
ABOUT SOME OF THE BASIC CONCEPTS TO MAKE SURE WE'RE
12 ALL ON THE SAME PAGE AND ALSO TO FOLLOW UP ON SOME OF
THE THINGS THAT DOUG MENTIONED.
13 A LITTLE BIT OF HISTORY: SECTION 508 WAS AMENDED IN
1998.
14 THERE WAS A PREVIOUS SECTION OF 508 THAT WAS PASSED
IN THE 1980S, BUT IT REALLY WASN'T ENFORCEABLE; IT
15 DIDN'T REQUIRE THE ACCESS BOARD TO COME UP WITH
STANDARDS.
16 AND IT DIDN'T ACTUALLY HAVE AN ENFORCEMENT CLAUSE.
AND IN 1998 AS PART OF THE WORK FORCE INVESTMENT ACT,
17 CHNG CHANGED THAT AND THEY TOOK CARE OF BOTH OF THOSE
SHORT SHORT SHORTS.
18 NOW AS DOUG MENTIONED, THERE ARE DEFINITELY STANDARDS
UNDER 508 THAT AGENCIES HAVE TO ABIDE BY WHEN THEY'RE
19 PROCURING TECHNOLOGY AND THERE'S ALSO A VERY CLEAR
ENFORCEMENT PROVISION IN 508 THAT PROVIDES THAT A
20 PERSON CAN SUE AN AGENCY UNDER 508 IF THE TECHNOLOGY
THAT'S PROCURED BY AN AGENCY DOESN'T COMPLY WITH THE
21 STANDARDS.
NOW, WHEN I SAY THAT I'VE GOTTEN INTO A BIT OF
22 TROUBLE IN THE PAST BECAUSE PEOPLE HAVE ALWAYS SAID,
WELL, 508 IS LIMITED STRICTLY TO PROCUREMENTS.
23 LET ME BACK UP AND TALK ABOUT 508 GENERALLY.
I TOLD YOU THERE'S THESE TWOP KEY THINGS THAT MAKE
24 5508 WORTH PAYING ATTENTION TO.
508 AN IS THE FIRST THING YOU SEE.
25 IT USES FOUR VERY BIG ALL-ENCOMPASSING VERBS.
IT SAYS DEVELOP, PROCURE, MAINTAIN, OR USE.

34

1 AND WHAT I MEAN BY THAT AND WHAT I WANT YOU TO THINK
OF, IT COVERS JUST ABOUT EVERYTHING UNDER THE SUN YOU
2 WOULD THINK.
WHAT IT SAYS IS THAT WHEN AN AGENCY DEVELOPS PRORXS
3 KURTZ, MAINTAINS OR USES ELECTRONIC INFORMATION
TECHNOLOGY THAT IT HAS TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT
4 TECHNOLOGY IS COMPARABLELY ACCESSIBLE TO PEOPLE WITH
DISABILITIES AND PEOPLE WITHOUT DISABILITIES.
5 AND IT TALKS ABOUT TWO DIFFERENT GROUPS: FEDERAL
EMPLOYEES AND MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC THAT ARE USING
6 THAT TECHNOLOGY.
THEN IF YOU READ FURTHER IN 508 TOWARDS THE BACK,
7 THERE'S PARAGRAPH F WHICH TALKS ABOUT ENFORCEMENT.
WHICH SAYS A PERSON CAN BRING SUIT UNDER AN AGENCY
8 UNDER THE SAME PROCESSES AS THE 504 COMPLAINTS.
I'LL TALK ABOUT 504 IN A BIT TOO, BECAUSE IT'S
9 IMPORTANT TO UNDERSTAND ALL THESE OTHER LAWS TOO.
IN 508 F IT SAYS THAT A PERSON CAN BRING SUIT AGAINST
10 AN AGENCY UNDER THE 504 PROCESSES BUT IT ALSO SAYS
THAT THE ENFORCEMENT PROVISION, THE THING THAT
11 AUTHORIZES THE LAWSUITS, IS ONLY LIMITED TO
ELECTRONIC AND INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY THAT'S PROCURED
12 AFTER A PARTICULAR DAY, SIX MONTHS AFTER THE DAY THAT
THE ACCESS BOARD CAME UP WITH THE STANDARDS.
13 AND HISTORY TELLS US THAT THAT MAGIC DATE IS JUNE 21,
2001.
14 THAT'S WHY EVERYBODY IS LOOKING AT 2001.
THERE WAS A LOT OF CONFUSION ABOUT THAT.
15 AGENCIES THOUGHT THEY HAD TO FIX EVERYTHING BY JUN 21
OTHERWISE THEY WERE GOING TO GET SUED.
16 SO THERE WERE AGENCIES THAT WERE RIPPING STUFF OFF
THEIR WEB SITES THAT THEY THOUGHT WAS INACCESSIBLE.
17 BUT THAT REALLY WASN'T THE RIGHT WAY OF GOING,
OBVIOUSLY.
18 IT WAS REALLY MORE OF A STARTING DATE THAN A
DEADLINE.
19 IT'S NOT LIKE EVERYTHING HAD TO BE FIXED BY THEN,
THAT WAS THE DATE THAT LAWSUITS COULD BEGIN.
20 SO EFFECTIVELY, WHAT 508 DOES IS IT BREAKS THE WORLD
OF TECHNOLOGY INTO TWO DIFFERENT CATEGORIES.
21 THOSE THINGS THAT ARE PROCURED BEFORE JUNE 21 AND
AFTER.
22 THAT'S THE BASIC IDEA.
NOW, DOUG TALKED ABOUT THE STANDARDS.
23 LET ME TALK VERY BRIEFLY ABOUT WHY IT'S IMPORTANT.
BUT BEFORE I DO THAT, LET ME DO EXACTLY WHAT DOUG DID
24 AND SURVEY THE AUDIENCE A LITTLE BIT JUST SO I CAN
FIGURE OUT HOW MUCH TIME I NEED TO BE SPENDING ON
25 THIS.
FIRST OF ALL, THE FIRST QUESTION IS JUST FOR MY OWN

35

1 CURIOSITY.
SINCE ALMOST EVERYONE RAISED THEIR HAND WHEN DOUG
2 ASKED IF THERE WERE ANY IT PEOPLE, I'LL ASK THE
FOLLOW-UP.
3 HOW MANY OF YOU ARE INVOLVED IN WEB TECHNOLOGIES?
OKAY.
4 THAT'S ABOUT 80 PERCENT OF THAT LAST 80 PERCENT.
SO THAT'S A PRETTY GOOD NUMBER.
5 HOW MANY OF YOU ARE PRIVATE SECTOR FOLKS? OKAY.
I GUESS THAT'S ABOUT, WHAT, 30, 40 PERCENT?
6 AND HOW MANY OF YOU ARE GOVERNMENT?
OKAY.
7 THAT'S ABOUT EVERYBODY ELSE.
AND HOW MANY ARE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT?
8 THAT'S EVERYBODY.
STATE GOVERNMENT?
9 AH, ONE PERSON.
OKAY, GREAT.
10 AND HOW MANY OF YOU HAVE ACTUALLY SEEN A SCREEN
READER IN USE?
11 AUTOMATIC.
A LARGE NUMBER OF YOU, OKAY.
12 SO I'M NOT GOING TO TELL YOU WHY SCREEN READERS ARE
IMPORTANT AND WHY IT'S IMPORTANT TO PROVIDE TEXT ON
13 WEB PAGES AND SOFTWARE PRODUCTS AND MAKE TEXT PAGES
AVAILABLE BECAUSE MOST OF YOU SEEM TO KNOW THAT.
14 SO THE OLD SECTION 508 WASN'T REALLY ENFORCEABLE AND
SO NOW WE'VE GOT THE T ONES.
15 I SHOULD ALSO ADD AS A TANGENT RIGHT NOW, THAT IF YOU
NEED ANY INFORMATION THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT LIKE
16 THE 508 STANDARDS, LIKE THE ACTUAL STATUTE ITSELF,
DEFINITELY TAKE A LOOK AT THE SECTION 508.GOV WEB
17 SITE.
IT'S QUITE AMAZING.
18 IT HAS ALL OF THIS INFORMATION IS THERE.
I DON'T HAVE HARD COPIES AND YOU PROBABLY DON'T
19 EITHER, SO I CAN'T JUST POINT TO A SECTION IN
PARAGRAPH 508 AND SAY THIS IS WHAT YOU SHOULD BE
20 LOOKING AT.
BUT IT'S IN SECTION 508 A AND 508 F ARE THE TWO
21 SECTIONS I MENTIONED BEFORE.
LET ME TALK ABOUT SOME OF THE LEGAL REQUIREMENTS.
22 WHEN I SAID 508 SAID THAT YOU HAVE THIS OBLIGATION TO
DEVELOP, PROCURE, MAINTAIN, OR USE THIS TECHNOLOGY IN
23 A WAY THAT IS AVAILABLE TO PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES,
I FORGOT TO MENTION THE DEFENSE ON THAT WHICH IS
24 UNDUE BURDEN.
THAT'S SOMETHING A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE BEEN VERY
25 CONCERNED ABOUT.
UNDUE BURDEN BASICALLY MEANS SIGNIFICANT DIFFICULTY

36

1 OR EXPENSE.
AND THIS IS REALLY PRECISE.
2 AND WHEN YOU TELL PROCUREMENT PEOPLE THAT THEY
CRINGE, AND WHEN YOU TELL LAWYERS THAT, THEY SMILE.
3 BASICALLY YOU HAVE TO MAKE -- YOU DON'T HAVE TO MAKE
SURE THAT THE INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY -- ELECTRONIC
4 AND INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY THAT YOU PROCURE OR THAT
YOU DEVELOP OR MAINTAIN OR USE HAS TO BE ACCESSIBLE
5 IF DOING SO WOULD CONSTITUTE AN UNDUE BURDEN.
UNDUE BURDEN MEANS SIGNIFICANT DIFFICULTY OR EXPENSE.
6 HERE I HAVE TO DRAWBACK A LITTLE BIT ON MY ADA
EXPERIENCE WHICH I USED TO DO FOR ABOUT SIX YEARS
7 BEFORE I WAS WORKING ON 508 AT THE JUSTICE
DEPARTMENT.
8 WE'VE TRADITIONALLY DEFINED UNDUE BURDEN AND THE
COURTS HAVE TRADITIONALLY DEFINED UNDUE BURDEN TO
9 REALLY BE AN EXTREMELY HIGH THRESHOLD.
THE ONLY THING I CAN GIVE YOU FOR EXAMPLES WHERE
10 DOCTORS OFFICES WOULD HAVE TO PAY FOR INTERPRETER
SERVICES FOR PATIENTS WHO ARE DEAF WHERE THE COST OF
11 THE INTERPRETER SERVICE WOULD FAR EXCEED THE AMOUNT
OF MONEY THAT THE DOCTOR WAS TAKING IN AS INCOME FROM
12 THAT PARTICULAR PATIENT.
AND INSTEAD WHAT THE DOCTOR HAD TO LOOK AT WAS THE
13 OVERALL FINANCIAL RESOURCES OF HIS ENTIRE OFFICE IN
TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHETHER HE COULD AFFORD TO PAY
14 FOR THE INTERPRETER SERVICE.
IT'S A VERY HIGH THRESHOLD.
15 AND AGENCIES ARE RECOGNIZED THIS.
AND SOME AGENCIES HAVE SET AN EXTREMELY HIGH
16 THRESHOLD AND SOME AGENCIES HAVE SET UP VERY
DEMANDING PROCESSES FOR PROCUREMENT PEOPLE IF THEY
17 WANT TO TRY TO MAKE AN UNDUE BURDEN -- IF THEY WANT
TO USE AN UNDUE BURDEN DEFENSE.
18 FOR INSTANCE, I BELIEVE IT'S THE POSTAL -- NO.
DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATIONTHAT BASICALLY REQUIRES
19 YOU TO WHEN YOU'RE MAKING AN UNDUE BURDEN
DETERMINATION, ONE OF THE THINGS THEY'RE RECOMMENDING
20 IS THAT YOU ACTUALLY HAVE TO TAKE IT UP TO THE
SECRETARY LEVEL IN ORDER TO GET IT CLEARED.
21 I THINK THE DEPARTMENT DPT ARMY HAS TAKEN A POSITION
THAT BEFORE ANYBODY COULD DO IT, BEFORE ANYONE COULD
22 MAKE AN UNDUE BURDEN DETERMINATION THAT THEY HAD TO
-- THAT THEY WERE GOING TO LOOK AT THE OVERALL
23 RESOURCES SO THE ENTIRE DEPARTMENT OF THE ARMY WHICH
OBVIOUSLY IS A HUGE AMOUNT OF MONEY, SO THEY REALLY
24 WANT TO MAKE IT VERY TOUGH FOR PEOPLE TO MAKE UNDUE
BURDEN DETERMINATIONS BECAUSE IF AN AGENCY USES UNDUE
25 BURDEN AS A DEFENSE, THAT MEANS THEY CAN BUY THE
INACCESSIBLE TECHNOLOGY.

37

1 BUT IF THEY BUY THE INACCESSIBLE TECHNOLOGY,
POTENTIALLY THEY OPEN THEMSELVES UP TO A LAWSUIT AND
2 AGENCY LITTLE TEND NOT TO LIKE THAT.
SO THEY WANT TO MAKE IT A VERY TOUGH BURDEN ON THEIR
3 PROCUREMENT OFFICERS.
THEY DON'T WANT TO MAKE IT AN EASY PROCESS TO SAY
4 IT'S JUST AN UNDUE BURDEN, I'M GOING TO PROCURE
SOMETHING THAT'S INACCESSIBLE.
5 I HAVE TO TURN ON MY PALM PILOT, BECAUSE I WAS TAKING
NOTES HERE.
6 ANOTHER CONCEPT WHICH IS IMPORTANT IS
FUNDAMENTAL ALTERATION WHICH I DON'T THINK THAT DOUG
7 TALKED ABOUT.
OKAY.
8 AND I SHOULD MENTION THIS IN THE CONTEXT OF THE
PAGER, THE BLACK BERRY EXAMPLE THAT THIS GENTLEMAN IN
9 THE FRONT ROW MENTIONED, IF MAKING SOMETHING
ACCESSIBLE WOULD SO FUNDAMENTALLY ALTER THE NATURE OF
10 THE PRODUCT AND THE PAGER IS A GREAT EXAMPLE, THEN IT
DOESN'T HAVE TO BE -- YOU DON'T HAVE TO BUY THE THING
11 THAT'S ACCESSIBLE AND ESSENTIALLY USE.
FOR INSTANCE, TO PROVIDE -- IF THE ONLY WAY THAT YOU
12 CAN MAKE A PAGER ACCESSIBLE FOR INSTANCE, PUTTING
VOICE OUTPUT TECHNOLOGY ASIDE, FOR INSTANCE, IF IT
13 WAS THE ONLY WAY TO MAKE IT ACCESSIBLE WAS TO HAVE A
REALLY LARGE DISPLAY OR A REALLY LARGE BRAILLE OUTPUT
14 DISPLAY, THEN THAT WOULD CONSTITUTE A FUNDAMENTAL
ALTERATION FOR SOMETHING WHEN YOU'RE TRYING TO BUY A
15 POCKET SIZE PAGER THAT SOMEBODY CAN VERY EASILY CARRY
AROUND.
16 THAT'S THE EXAMPLE THAT'S ACTUALLY USED IN THE ACCESS
BOARD'S PREAMBLE, THE ANALYSIS OF COMPANIES THE FINAL
17 STANDARDS.
SO YOU CAN FEEL OKAY ABOUT GOING OFF AND PROCURING
18 YOUR BLACK BERRIES WITHOUT HAVING TO GO BACK TO THEM
AND DEMAND THAT THEY MAKE IT EIGHT TIMES AS LARGE AND
19 ACCESSIBLE.
THE OTHER CONCEPT WHICH DOUG MENTIONED WAS COMMERCIAL
20 AVAILABILITY BUT LET ME TOUCH ON THAT A LITTLE BIT
MORE.
21 IT'S SOMETHING THAT'S ACTUALLY COMMERCIALLY
AVAILABLE.
22 THE -- IF SOMETHING'S ACTUALLY COMMERCIALLY AVAILABLE
LIKE A PAGER OR LIKE A WORD PROCESSOR, THEN YOU LOOK
23 AT THE THINGS WHICH ARE ACTUALLY OUT THERE IF YOU'RE
BUYING SOMETHING, SAY, OFF OF GSA SCHEDULE AND THE
24 FACT THAT SOMETHING HASN'T BEEN INVENTED YET DOESN'T
MEAN THAT YOU CAN'T GO AHEAD AND BUY IT.
25 THE IDEA IS THAT WE'RE NOT -- YOU DON'T -- THE 508
STANDARDS ARE NOT TRYING TO SLOW DOWN GOVERNMENT

38

1 PROCUREMENT, BUT YOU ARE OBLIGATED TO LOOK AT ALL THE
THINGS THAT ARE OUT THERE AND TRY TO FIND THE THING
2 THAT IS THE MOST ACCESSIBLE.
BUT IF YOU THINK ABOUT IT, THIS CREATES OBVIOUS
3 COMPETITION BETWEEN MANUFACTURERS AS THEY TRY TO MAKE
SOMETHING MORE AND MORE ACCESSIBLE BECAUSE THAT MEANS
4 THAT THE GOVERNMENT AGENCIES WHEN THEY'RE PROCURING
THESE PIECES OF TECHNOLOGY REALLY SHOULD BE LOOKING
5 FOR THE MOST ACCESSIBLE ONE AND THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT
THE ACCESS BOARD STANDARDS SAY AND THAT'S THE
6 GUIDANCE WE'VE BEEN GIVING OUT.
I'VE TALKED A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE -- ACTUALLY I
7 TALKED A LOT ABOUT THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN SUBSECTION
AN AND F IN THE FIEFD 08 STANDARDS.
8 BUT WHAT DOES IT MEAN WHEN -- I'M GOING TO TALK A
LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE ACTUAL STANDARDS NOW AND SAY
9 THAT BECAUSE SINCE YOU ACTUALLY HAVE TO FOLLOW THE
STANDARDS AND AS YOU'RE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT IF
10 YOU'RE GOING TO GET SUED OR NOT, IT'S IMPORTANT TO
HAVE A REALLY GOOD UNDERSTANDING OF THE STANDARDS.
11 AND IT THE ONLY THING I WOULD ADD TO DOUG'S
DISCUSSION OF THAT IS THAT THERE ARE TWO DIFFERENT
12 TYPES OF STANDARDS IN THE 508 STANDARDS, FOUR
PARTICULAR TYPES OF TECHNOLOGY.
13 THERE'S THE ACTUAL TECHNICAL STANDARDS AND THEY'RE
REALLY SPELLED OUT FOR WEB SOFTWARE AND THE OTHER
14 CATEGORIES WHICH I CAN'T RATTLE OFF THE TOP OF MY
HEAD LIKE DOUG CAN AND THEN THERE ARE THE FUNCTIONAL
15 PERFORMANCE CRITERIA WHICH ACTUALLY GETS INTO ANOTHER
IMPORTANT CONCEPT WHICH IS IN THE 508 REGULATIONS
16 WHICH IS EQUIVALENT FACILITATION.
THE IDEA HERE IS THAT IF SOMETHING DOESN'T ACTUALLY
17 MEET THE TECHNICAL STANDARDS, IT IS POSSIBLE TO USE
AN ALTERNATIVE FORM OF TECHNOLOGY THAT ACCOMPLISHES
18 THE SAME THINGS FOR ACCESSIBILITY.
AND THE EXAMPLE THAT I ALWAYS LIKE TO USE FOR THOSE
19 OF YOU WHO KNOW SOFTWARE TECHNOLOGY IS JAVA.
JAVA DOESN'T ACTUALLY COMMUNICATE THROUGH THE
20 OPERATING SYSTEM WHICH IS ONE OF THE REQUIREMENTS IN
THE ACCESS BOARD STANDARDS FOR SOFTWARE, BUT INSTEAD
21 IT DOES ESSENTIALLY THE SAME THING THROUGH SOMETHING
CALLED THE JAVA ACCESS BRIDGE AND THROUGH THEIR
22 APPLICATION PROGRAMMING INTERFACE FOR ACCESSIBILITY.
SO YOU CAN -- AND THE POINT OF THIS AND THE REASON
23 THIS IS IMPORTANT IS THAT IT ALSO CREATES ANOTHER
INCENTIVE FOR MANUFACTURERS WHICH IS THAT IT WAS TO
24 EVEN THOUGH THE 508 STANDARDS, THE VERY TECHNICAL
STANDARDS ARE SOMEWHAT LIMITING, THIS CREATES AN
25 INCENTIVE TO COME UP WITH NEW TECHNOLOGIES OR MORE
INNOVATIVE WAYS OF PROVIDING FOR ACCESSIBILITY.

39

1 AND IF YOU LOOK AT THE FUNCTIONAL PERFORMANCE
CRITERIA IN THE ACCESS BOARD STANDARDS, -- IS IT HOT
2 IN HERE?
OKAY.
3 I WAS JUST WORDING WHY I'M SUDDENLY FEELING AWFULLY
HOT.
4 IF YOU LOOK AT THE FUNCTIONAL PERFORMANCE CRITERIA IN
THE 508 STANDARDS, IT TALKS ABOUT THINGS LIKE MAKING
5 SURE THAT SOMETHING IS AVAILABLE THROUGH ALTERNATIVE
SENSES.
6 SO IF SOMETHING IS AVAILABLE THROUGH SPEECH, THAT'S
ALSO AVAILABLE VISUALLY AND VICE VERSA.
7 NOW, I SAID BEFORE THAT THE 508 IS ONLY ENFORCEABLE
WITH RESPECT TO TECHNOLOGY THAT'S ACTUALLY PROCURED
8 AFTER JUNE 21 OF THIS YEAR.
BUT WHAT DOES THAT MEAN -- WHAT ABOUT EVERYTHING
9 ELSE?
WELL, 508 ISN'T ACTUALLY ENFORCEABLE WITH RESPECT TO
10 THOSE THINGS WHICH ARE NOT PROCURED.
SO IF YOU'RE JUST DOING, SAY, IN-HOUSE DEVELOPMENT,
11 508 TECHNICALLY ISN'T ENFORCEABLE WITH RESPECT TO
THAT.
12 AND ALSO MAINTENANCE AND USE.
THOSE ARE ALSO THINGS THAT 508 DOESN'T COVER IN ITS
13 ENFORCEMENT SECTION.
BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT AGENCIES SHOULDN'T BE
14 THINKING ABOUT THOSE THINGS.
FIRST OF ALL, IT'S A LEGAL REQUIREMENT, AND ALSO 508
15 ISN'T ALONE OUT THERE.
THERE'S ALSO SECTION 501 AND 504 OF THE
16 REHABILITATION ACT.
AND WHAT DO THOSE STATUTES COVER?
17 WELL, SECTION 50 ONE 1 COVERS FEDERAL EMPLOYMENT 5 ON
4 IS FEDERALLY CORRECTED PROGRAMS OR -- AND THE IDEA
18 IS -- AND THOSE TWO PIECES OF LEGISLATION BY THE WAY
HAVE BEEN AROUND FOR QUITE A BIT LONGER THAN 508 HAS.
19 THOSE TWO PIECES OF LEGISLATION PROVIDE THAT PEOPLE
WITH DISABILITIES HAVE TO BE ACCOMMODATED EITHER IN
20 THE EMPLOYMENT CONTEXT OR IF THEY'RE TRYING TO SEEK
SERVICES OR BENEFITS OF SOMETHING THAT'S FEDERALLY
21 YOU UNDERSTAND FUNDED OR SOMETHING THAT'S FEDERALLY
CONDUCTED AND THOSE ARE IMPORTANT BECAUSE IF YOU
22 THINK ABOUT IT IF YOU'RE PROVIDING INFORMATION
TECHNOLOGY TO YOUR EMPLOYEES OR TO MEMBERS OF THE
23 PUBLIC, CHANCES ARE IT'S ALSO COVERED BY 501 OR 504.
SO EVEN THE THINGS THAT AREN'T SPECIFICALLY
24 ENFORCEABLE UNDER 508 MAY BE ENFORCEABLE UNDER 501 OR
504.
25 BUT THE DIFFERENCE IS -- AND THIS IS A BIT OFFA OF A
BROAD OVERSIMPLEIFICATION, BUT 5501 AND FIVE 04 ARE

40

1 ACCOMMODATING AN INDIVIDUAL AS OPPOSED TO TRYING TO
MAKE THE TECHNOLOGY ITSELF ACCESSIBLE.
2 OF COURSE ONE WAY OF ACCOMMODATEING THAT INDIVIDUAL
IS BY MAKING THE TECHNOLOGY ACCESSIBLE BUT THERE MAY
3 BE OTHER WAYS.
IT MAY REQUIRE PERSON TO PERSON INTERACTION WITH THE
4 GOVERNMENT AGENCY TO TRY TO PROVIDE THIS INFORMATION
TO THE PERSON WITH DISABILITY.
5 AND FINALLY THAT OTHER THING THAT'S OUT THERE LOOMING
ON THE HORIZON THAT EVERYBODY WORRY ABOUT IS THE ADA
6 WHICH IS THE BIG QUESTION MARK RIGHT NOW.
I HAVE A WHOLE OTHER PRESENTATION ABOUT ADA AND THE
7 INTERNET WHICH I I /* WON'T GET INTO TODAY, BUT IT
DOESN'T APPLY TO SINCE ALMOST ALL OF YOU ARE FEDERAL
8 AGENCY PEOPLE, IT DOESN'T APPLY TO FEDERAL AGENCIES.
BUT IT MAY EVENTUALLY HAVE SOME IMPACT AND THE
9 JUSTICE DEPARTMENT HAS TAKEN THE POSITION IN SEVERAL
BRIEFS THAT WE'VE WRITTEN THAT THE AADA DOES COVER
10 INTERNET ACTIVITIES.
BUT WE'VE NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT STANDARDS.
11 SO WITH THAT I'LL END NOW AND SHOULD I TAKE
QUESTIONS?
12 OR WOULD YOU LIKE TO GO NOW, TERRY?
OKAY.
13 SURE.
THERE'S A QUESTION BACK HERE.
14 >> SECTION 504, IS IT TRUE THAT STATE AND
LOCAL GOVERNMENTS WHO RECEIVE FEDERALLY FUNDED
15 PROGRAMS LIKE SECTION 50 --
>> WELL, NO.
16 TECHNICALLY NO BECAUSE THEY STR TO ACCOMMODATE
INDIVIDUALS WITH DISABILITIES IF THEY'RE TRYING TO
17 ACCESS THE SERVICES OR THE INFORMATION OR WHATEVER
PROGRAM THAT YOU'RE RUNNING.
18 BUT THERE'S NOTHING THAT SAYS THAT JUST BECAUSE
YOU'RE FEDERALLY FUNDED THAT YOU HAVE TO ADOPT A 508
19 STANDARDS.
HAVING SAID THAT, THERE IS ANOTHER QUESTION WHICH I
20 REALLY DON'T LIKE TO GET INTO WHICH IS THE ASSISTIVE
TECHNOLOGY ACT.
21 A LOT OF STATES ARE UNDER THE IMPRESSION THAT IF THEY
RECEIVE MONEY UNDER THE TECH ACT THAT THEY HAVE TO --
22 THAT THEY HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT ALL OF THEIR
INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY FOLLOWS THE 508 STANDARDS.
23 THIS IS CURRENTLY AN UNSETTLED POSITION THAT DOESN'T
ACTUALLY FALL WITHIN 508; IT'S ACTUALLY AN
24 INTERPRETATION OF THE ASSISTIVE TECHNOLOGY ACT AND
SINCE THE DEPARTMENT DPT EDUCATION IS RESPONSIBLE FOR
25 OVERSIGHT OF THE ASSISTIVE TECHNOLOGY ACT, I CAN'T
COMMENT ON THAT; I HAVE TO LEAVE THAT TO THEM.

41

1 QUESTION BACK HERE.
>> WHAT IS THE OBLIGATION OF A WEB PAGE,
2 CREATING THE WEB PAGE YOU WANT TO PUT A THAT WAS
DEVELOPED OR PROCURED BEFORE 6/21 AND IT'S NOT
3 FEDERALLY COMPLIANT --
>> I HATE TO USE THIS, BUT IS IT SOMETHING
4 THAT'S PROCURED?
OR IS IT SOMETHING THAT'S IN-HOUSE DEVELOPED?
5 OKAY.
WELL, IF IT'S PROCURED THEN -- WELL,.
6 >> IS IT BEING MAINTAINED IN HOUSE OR BY A
CONTRACTOR?
7 >> THE EXAMPLE WOULD BE A CD-ROM THAT'S
EDUCATIONAL AND A CD-ROM THAT MIGHT REPRESENT -- YOU
8 WANT TO PUT IT ON YOUR WEB SITE, YOU HAVE TO MAKE
THAT...
9 >> YEAH.
UNDER 508 IF YOU'RE IN-HOUSE FOLKS ARE JUST PUTTING
10 UP THIS THING WHICH IS PROCURED, THEN TECHNICALLY
UNDER 508 ITSELF, NO.
11 BUT AS DOUG WAS MENTIONING UNDER HIS BREATH YOU STILL
HAVE 504 OBLIGATIONS AND THAT'S ABSOLUTELY TRUE.
12 AND YOU MAY VERY WELL -- DEPENDING UPON HOW CLOSELY
OBSERVED YOUR WEB PAGE IS, YOU MAY GET AMOUNT OF
13 FLACK FOR THAT.
QUESTION RIGHT NEXT TO THAT GENTLEMAN.
14 >> YOU MENTIONED A LITTLE BIT CLOSER TO --
IS THERE A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WHETHER OR NOT THE
15 DEVELOPMENT OF THE MAINTENANCE, THE USE, THE WORK
IN-HOUSE PROJECTS AND WHATNOT IS BY CIVIL EMPLOYEES
16 OR CONTRACTORS?
>> YEAH.
17 THIS IS ACTUALLY A GSA ISSUE, BUT TERRY YOU CAN NOD
UP AND DOWN OR SIDE TO SIDE, BUT IF YOU HAVE
18 CONTRACTORS THAT ARE IN HOUSE THAT ARE ESSENTIALLY
PERFORMING THE FUNCTIONS OF -- THE SAME FUNCTIONS AS
19 A FEDERAL EMPLOYEE DEVELOPING A WEB PAGE, THEN THE
WEB PAGE THAT THE CONTRACTOR'S WORKING ON WOULD BE
20 CONSIDERED PROCUREMENT.
>> IF YOU'RE PAYING MONEY IT'S
21 PROCUREMENT?
>> YES.
22 >> THAT ALL THE WEB DEVELOPMENT THAT MIGHT
BE CHANCY TO THE CIVIL SERVICE.
23 >> YES.
THAT'S UNFORTUNATELY ONE OF THE PLACES WE'RE LEFT
24 WITH.
I'LL TELL YOU, ONE OF THE BIG PROBLEMS WITH 508 IS IS
25 THAT -- ENFORCEMENT PARAGRAPH DOES NOT SAY ANYTHING
ABOUT PROCURED OR PRODUCED BEFORE JUNE 21.

42

1 WE STARE AT THAT PARAGRAPH AN AWFUL LOT AND SAYING
WHY DOESN'T IT SAY DEVELOP?
2 TO ME IT MAKES PERFECT SENSE THAT THE WAY 508 SHOULD
HAVE BEEN WRITTEN IS THAT ANYTHING THAT'S NEW WHETHER
3 IT'S IN-HOUSE DEVELOPED OR PROCURED, NO MATTER WHO
DOES, IT SHOULD COMPLY WITH THE STANDARD, BUT
4 UNFORTUNATELY THAT'S NOT WHAT 508 SAYS.
>> CONTRACTOR AND THE CONTRACTOR IS UNDER
5 CONTRACT TO PROVIDE SERVICES, GENERAL SERVICES TO THE
AGENCY, YOU'RE NOT PROCURING THAT PAGE.
6 YOU HAVE PROCURED THEIR SERVICES.
>> YES, I AGREE.
7 BUT I'VE TALKED TO THE FOLKS AT GSAN AND THIS HAS KIM
BEEN THE ANSWER OF SEVERAL PEOPLE THAT IF YOU HAVE AN
8 IN-HOUSE CONTRACTOR THAT LOOKS LIKE A FEDERAL
EMPLOYEE, SMELLS LIKE A FEDERAL EMPLOYEE, REPORTS IN
9 THE SAME CHAIN OF COMMAND AS A FEDERAL EMPLOYEE, THAT
THE FACT THAT THEY'RE A CONTRACTOR AND THEY'RE DOING
10 THE WORK, IT MAKES IT A TOTALLY DIFFERENT ISSUE THAN
IF IT'S THE CIVIL SERVANT WHO'S DOING IT.
11 COULD I ACTUALLY TAKE THIS AFTERWARDS?
I PROMISE I'LL GET BACK TO YOU, IT'S JUST THAT WE'RE
12 RUNNING OUT OF TIME AND I SHOULD REALLY TURN IT OVER
TO TERRY.
13 OKAY, THANKS.
(APPLAUSE)
14 >> GOOD AFTERNOON, AND I'M THE THIRD OF
THREE AND I KNOW YOU'RE ALL ANXIOUS TO KEEP ON TIME
15 HERE.
SO I WANT TO THANK YOU ALL FOR BEING HERE AND I'M
16 ALSO REALLY GLAD THAT A LOT OF THE HOT QUESTIONS GOT
HANDLED BY MY PANEL MEANS HERE.
17 MY NAME IS TERRY WEAVER, THE DIRECTOR OF
ACCOMMODATIONS AT GSA WHERE WE FOCUS ON MAKING 5 ON 8
18 HAPPEN FOR THE AGENCIES.
WE'VE HAD A LOT OF DISCUSSION RECENTLY ON WHAT THE
19 RELATION IS WITH, WHAT THE REGULATIONS ARE WHAT THE
LAWS ARE [].
20 I HAVE A DIFFERENT FOCUS NOW.
I'M HERE TO HELP YOU.
21 WE DO THAT DIFFERENT WAYS, BUT BASICALLY WE'RE ABOUT
RESOURCES.
22 THE MAIN RESOURCE IS THE SEXZ 508.GOV WEB SITE YOU
CAN GET A LOT OF INFORMATION THERE.
23 YOU CAN EVEN GET TO THESE GUYS THAT WAY.
ONE OF THE THINGS WE'RE TRIED TO DO ON THAT WEB SITE
24 FRANKLY IS TO TAKE THEIR BRAINS AND PUT IT IN PAGES
-- YOU DIDN'T KNOW THAT, DIDN'T YOU, KEN?
25 WE HAVE A LOT OF WHAT YOU'LL SEE OUT THERE FRANKLY
HAS BEEN HEAVILY INFLUENCED BY BOTH KEN AND DOUG AND

43

1 OTHER MEMBERS OF OUR INTERAGENCY GROUP WHO HAVE
WORKED WITH US OVER THESE PAST MONTHS AND YEARS AND
2 MAKING THINGS HAPPEN.
THE WEB PAGE ALSO ALLOWS FOR SOMETHING THAT IS VERY
3 OBVIOUS IN HERE, QUESTIONS.
YOU CAN SEND THE QUESTION IN AND THE QUESTION IS
4 GOING TO GO TO THE AUTHORITY.
I KNOW THAT DOUG GETS A LOT OF TRAFFIC OFF THE WEB
5 SITE AS A TECHNICAL EXPERT AND WE LINK BACK TO THE
ACCESS BOARD SITE WHERE YOU CAN FIND A LOT OF GOOD
6 INFORMATION ON TECHNICAL ASSISTANCE DOCUMENTS FOCUSED
ON EACH OF THE DIFFERENT CATEGORIES OF THE STANDARDS.
7 A LOT OF GREAT INFORMATION OUT THERE.
ON THE WEB SITE WE ALSO HAVE A TRAINING MODULE FOR
8 DESIGNING ACCESSIBLE WEB SITES.
NOT ONLY IS IT A GOOD TOOL TO HELP YOU DESIGN YOUR
9 SITE, IT'S ALSO A GOOD TUTORIAL ON WHAT IS SECTION
508.
10 WE FOUND IN DESIGNING OUR WEB SITE THAT
OUR GOAL WAS TO HAVE IT MODEL A GOOD ACCESSIBLE SITE
11 AND IT'S AN ACCESSIBLE SITE NOT TO DO WHAT -- I KNOW
I'VE HEARD DOUG GO ON ABOUT, NOT TO DUMB DOWN THE
12 SITE, BUT ACTUALLY TO SHOW THERE'S A LOT OF CREATIVE
INTERESTING THINGS THAT YOU CAN PUT OUT THERE AND
13 STILL BE ACCESSIBLE.
SO YOU CAN GO OUT THERE AND LEARN ABOUT DESIGNING
14 ACCESSIBLE SITES, YOU CAN GO OUT THERE, GET
INFORMATION ABOUT OTHER ACTIVITIES GOING ON AROUND
15 THE GOVERNMENT, YOU CAN GO OUT THERE AND CLING INTO
SOME KEY RESOURCES THAT YOU MAY BE INTERESTED IN
16 DOING, NEEDING TO DOING FOR YOUR JOB.
HOW MANY PEOPLE IN HERE RECOGNIZE THE FACT THAT IF
17 YOU'RE A FEDERAL WORKER YOU'RE A REQUIRING OFFICIAL?
DID YOU KNOW THAT?
18 THERE'S SOMEBODY THAT KNOWS.
THERE'S ANOTHER PERSON THAT KNOWS.
19 THE FAR LANGUAGE THAT PUT IN PLACE ON JUNE 25 SAID
REQUIRING OFFICIALS HAVE TO MAKE THIS DETERMINATION
20 ON ACCESSIBILITY OF PRODUCTS.
IF ANYBODY WENT BACK TO THEIR OLD OPM POSITION
21 DESCRIPTION AND READ IT YOU WON'T FIND THAT TERM IN
THERE.
22 BUT CONGRATULATIONS, YOU ARE ONE.
YOU USE TECHNOLOGY TO DELIVER PROGRAMS.
23 YOU USE TECHNOLOGY -- YOU SPECIFIC REQUIREMENTS TO
DELIVER PROGRAMS.
24 THAT MAKES YOU THE PERSON WHO UNDERSTANDS WHAT YOU'RE
TRYING TO DO WITH THAT TECHNOLOGY.
25 THAT MEANS YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND HOW TO USE
ACCESSIBLE TECHNOLOGY.

44

1 IT'S A GOOD NEWS AND A BAD NEWS KIND OF THING.
CONGRATULATIONS YOU'RE REQUIRING OFFICIAL,.
2 WE HAVE A PORTAL THAT IS UNDERWAY ON OUR SITE THAT IS
A COLLABORATIVE EFFORT BETWEEN INDUSTRY AND THE
3 FEDERAL GOVERNMENT IN TRYING TO BRING TO ONE PLACE
WHERE YOU CAN FIND OUT HOW A GIVEN PRODUCT MEET
4 LITTLE THE -- OR ADDRESSES THE STANDARD.
AND THAT'S THE BUY ACCESSIBLE BUTTON ON THE SECTION
5 508.GOV WEB SITE WHO'DA THOUGHT IT?
SO IF YOU GO TO THE BUY ACCESSIBLE PORTAL, YOU CAN DO
6 A SEARCH ON DIFFERENT PRODUCTS AND AS THE VENDORS
COME UP THERE AND PUT ON THEIR INFORMATION, YOU CAN
7 FIND OUT WHAT PRODUCTS ARE AVAILABLE.
FOR INSTANCE, YOU WANT DO A SEARCH ON COLOR COPIERS,
8 YOU CAN DO THAT AND COMPARE THE DIFFERENT PRODUCTS BY
THE STANDARD TO EACH OTHER TO FIND OUT WHICH ONES ARE
9 THE ONES THAT ARE MOST ACCESSIBLE WHICH FRANKLY IS
GOING TO WORK IN YOUR ENVIRONMENT TOO.
10 SO YOU HAVE A BIG JOB BUT WE HAVE SOME RESOURCES TO
POINT YOU TO.
11 WE ALSO HAVE SOMETHING THAT'S GOING ON, ANOTHER
COLLABORATIVE EFFORT CALLED THE ACCESSIBILITY FORUM.
12 I KNOW THERE ARE A NUMBER OF PEOPLE HERE THAT BELONG
TO IT AND THAT'S A GROUP OF PEOPLE WHO ARE REALLY
13 DEDICATED ON TRYING TO MAKE IT MORE OF A SIMPLE JOB
TO MAKE FOLKS UNDERSTAND IT'S AN ACCESSIBLE JOB
14 PRODUCT.
IT'S A MIX OF THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, MEMBERS OF THE
15 PANELS AND OTHERS, IT ALSO INCLUDES THE IT COMMUNITY,
THE VENDORS WHO MANUFACTURE AS WELL AS SELL PRODUCTS
16 TO US AS FEDERAL GOVERNMENT WORKERS, AND THE
ASSISTIVE TECHNOLOGY COMMUNITY, ACADEMICS, AND THE
17 ADVOCACY GROUPS FOR PEOPLE WITH DISABILITY, THE
CONSUMER GROUPS THAT SAY, WAIT A MINUTE, I KNOW WHAT
18 ACCESSIBILITY LOOKZ LIKE, ASK ME.
THIS GROUP OF PEOPLE HAS BEEN WORKING SINCE THIS PAST
19 MAY IN TRYING TO COME UP WITH THE MEANS FOR US TO BE
ABLE TO IDENTIFY PRODUCTS.
20 IT'S LIKE MANAGING JELLO.
AND IT'S A HARD EFFORT BUT THEY'RE REALLY INVOLVED IN
21 IT AND IT'S SOMETHING YOU CAN LOOK INTO YOURSELF AND
SAY IS THERE A ROLE FOR ME TO HELP OUT ON THIS TOO.
22 SO THERE'S A LOT OF ACTIVITY OUT THERE FOR YOU TO GET
INVOLVED IN IN NS OF WHAT YOU CAN DO PERSONALLY.
23 THERE'S ALSO THE ABILITY FOR YOU TO HELP YOUR 508
COORDINATOR AND I'M SURE I KNOW FOR A FACT WE HAVE
24 508 COORDINATORS IN HERE.
THESE ARE THE PEOPLE WHO ARE EMBEDDED IN YOUR
25 ORGANIZATION WHO'S BEFORE GIVEN THE WONDERFUL TASK TO
MAKE YOUR AGENCY 508 READY.

45

1 AND THAT MEANS THAT THEY HAVE TO DEVELOP A CROSS
AGENCY TEAM OF PEOPLE FROM THE HR FUNCTION, FROM THE
2 IT FUNCTION, FROM THE PROCUREMENT FUNCTION, A PRETTY
BIG CROWD.
3 IF YOU'RE NOT THE 508 COORDINATOR, FIND YOUR 508
COORDINATOR, AND VOLUNTEER YOUR HELP; THEY NEED IT.
4 HELP THEM MAKE THE PROCESSES WORK, HELP THEM IDENTIFY
THE PROCEDURES YOU NEED TO PUT IN PLACE TO IDENTIFY
5 PROBLEMS THE PROCEDURES TO PUT IN PLACE TO MAKE SURE
YOU ROLL PRODUCTS OUT THAT ARE ACCESSIBLE.
6 BOTH DOUG AND KENNETH TALKED ABOUT THE STANDARD.
THE REALITY IS THAT THE ACCESS BOARD STANDARD WENT
7 INTO EFFECT IN FEBRUARY.
AT THAT POINT THE GOVERNMENT WAS TOLD YOU SHOULD BE
8 DEVELOPING USING MAINTAINING PROCURING THINGS THAT
ARE ACCESSIBLE.
9 OKAY.
WE'LL DELAY THE PROCUREMENT STUFF TO JUNE, BUT THE
10 REST OF THE STUFF YOU SHOULD BE DOING NOW.
THE OTHER STUFF, IT DOESN'T HAVE THE TEETH IN IT BUT
11 IT HAS THE INTENT AND THAT'S WHAT WE'RE ABOUT, MAKING
IT HAPPEN.
12 YOU HAVE THE ABILITY OUT THERE.
JUST TO REITERATE, YOU ARE NOT JUST CHARGED WITH
13 DOING THE JOB; YOU'RE CHARGED WITH MAKING THE
GOVERNMENT A BETTER PLACE FOR PEOPLE WITH
14 DISABILITIES.
YOU'RE NOT BY YOURSELF, YOU HAVE LOTS OF RESOURCES.
15 PLEASE COME CHECK OUT OUR WEB SITE, CHECK OUT OUR
TRAINING, IF YOU'RE INTERESTED AND WANT TO GET MORE
16 INVOLVED, SEND US A MESSAGE.
LET US KNOW YOU'RE OUT THERE AND YOU CAN WORK WITH
17 ALL OF US IN GETTING YOUR JOB EASIER AND THE REST OF
OUR JOBS EASIER.
18 AND SINCE WE'RE TRYING TO KEEP OUR TIME FRAME, WE
HAVE A FEW MINUTES FOR QUESTIONS FOR ANY OF THE PANEL
19 MEMBERS.
>> (NOT AUDIBLE.
20 >> WHAT GOVERNS THE WHOLE PROCUREMENT
ASPECT IS THE FAR.
21 IF ACQUIRING THE SERVICES OF SOMEBODY, YOU'RE
SPENDING GOVERNMENT FUNDS AND YOU'RE BOUND BY THE FAR
22 WHICH INCORPORATELESS THE STANDARD TO IT.
SO IN THAT CASE, YES.
23 IF YOU'RE USING A CONTRACTOR, YOU'RE BOUND UNDER THE
FAR TO FOLLOW THE REGULATIONS OF 508.
24 >> THIS IS DOUG'S.
DOUG: ACTUALLY KEN AND I WERE FLIPPING A
25 COIN BECAUSE IT'S EITHER ONE OF US.
PROPER SIGNAGE, FIRST.

46

1 AND THE NICE THING ABOUT IT IS THAT MANY PEOPLE WON'T
EVEN SEE WHAT YOU DO TO MAKE IT MORE ACCESSIBLE
2 UNLESS THEY NEED TO.
FOR EXAMPLE, YOU CAN HAVE ALL THE GRAPHICS YOU WANT
3 AS LONG AS YOU -- IF THEY HAVE SOME SIGNIFICANCE, A
SIGN, AN ALT AN ATTRIBUTE.
4 THAT IS A WAY OF SIGN SOMETHING TEXT.
AND IT'S MAYBE AS SIMPLE AS SAYING IMAGE OF
5 DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE'S LOGO.
THAT'S ALL YOU NEED.
6 NOBODY WANTS TO READ THE DESCRIPTION OF THE LOGO 16
TIMES ON EVERY PAGE.
7 ON THE OTHER HAND, YOU MAY HAVE AN IMAGE THAT SAYS
CLICK HERE FOR HELP.
8 AND IT LAUNCHES ANOTHER WINDOW AND GIVES YOU HELP.
AS LONG AS THERE IS TEXT TO GO ALONG, SAY, WITH THE
9 HELPING HAND IMAGE.
THAT'S THE SIMPLEST, THE FASTEST, THE EASIEST WAY TO
10 REALLY MAKE A DIFFERENCE.
AND THEN THERE ARE OTHER THINGS.
11 THERE'S PROPER WAYS TO CODE TABLES SO THAT THEY CAN
USING HTML CODES BECAUSE MANY PEOPLE OFTEN DO WHAT I
12 CALL TYPEWRITER FORMATTING AND ANYTIME YOU TAKE
ANYTHING THAT'S TYPEWRITER FORMATTED, THAT IS YOU
13 TABBED OVER, REMEMBER TYPING COURSES YOU WENT TO THE
CENTER AND YOU SPELLED WHAT YOU WERE CENTERING BY,
14 YOU KNOW, I WOULD BE DOUG -- AND YOU GO BACK HALF THE
DISTANCE.
15 THAT'S TYPEWRITER FORMATING.
SEE, I'M VERY OLD.
16 AND IT DRIVES ME CRAZY IF SOMEBODY SENDS ME A
WORDPERFECT DOCUMENT OR A WORD DOCUMENT AND THEY'VE
17 DONE THAT BECAUSE YOU CAN'T CONVERT THAT VERY WELL
BECAUSE -- AND IT'S THE SAME THING WITH HTML.
18 YOU CAN'T CONVERT HTML INTO USABLE SPEECH OUTPUT IF
THE PROPER CODES.
19 SO IN OUR GUIDE WHICH YOU WOULD FIND AT
WWW.ACCESS-BOARD.GOV, AND THEN IF YOU GO/508.HTM,
20 THAT'LL TAKE YOU RIGHT TO THE 508 SECTION AND GO TO
GUIDE TO THE STANDARDS.
21 AND THERE'S A SECTION FOR SOFTWARE AND THERE'S A
SECTION FOR WEB THAT WILL EXPLAIN THIS A LOT BETTER
22 THAN I'M DOING NOW AND YOU CAN READ IT AT YOUR
LEISURE.
23 IT GIVES EXAMPLES, IT TALKS ABOUT JAVASCRIPTS.
WE DO JAVASCRIPTS ARE FINE.
24 WE DON'T HAVE ANY PROBLEM WITH PLUG-INS.
WE HAVE SOME RESTRICTIONS ON THEM.
25 DOES THAT ANSWER YOUR QUESTION?
HE DOESN'T BELIEVE ME, BUT IT ANSWERS IT.

47

1 (LAUGHTER).
>> FOR THE LAST YEAR I'VE BEEN ADDING ALT
2 TAGS.
TO WHAT EXTENT...
3 >> YOU MEAN ON THE STUFF THAT'S ALREADY
BEEN PUT UP THERE?
4 WELL, YOU'RE RIGHT.
YOU ONLY -- IF YOU GET BORED YOU CAN GO BACK AND DO A
5 FEW, BUT IN ALL HONESTY, YOU WANT TO FOCUS ON THE NEW
STUFF AND JUST BE PREPARED THAT IF SOMEBODY NEEDS TO
6 KNOW SOMETHING, WHAT AGENCY ARE YOU WITH?
USDA, OKAY.
7 SO IF SOMEBODY HAS A REASON THAT THEY NEED SOME
PHOTOGRAPHS, OH, MAYBE THEY'RE DOING SOMETHING ON THE
8 DUST BOWL DAYS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, OR YOU KNOW,
THE FIRST INTRODUCTION OF WHEAT IN PACKIST AN, I
9 DON'T KNOW, THEY WOULD BE ABLE TO AT LEAST CALL
SOMEBODY [] AND GET ACCESS TO THE PICTURES AND THAT
10 WOULD MEET YOUR OBLIGATION IN THAT CASE BECAUSE YOU
STILL HAVE AN OBLIGATION TO PROVIDE THE INFORMATION
11 IN SOME WAY.
IT JUST MEANS THAT BEFORE JUNE 21 YOU HAD THE
12 PLEXIBILITY OF USING THE TELEPHONE.
AFTER JUNE 21 YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO PUT THE INFORMATION
13 ON THE SITE.
>> HOW DOES THE SUBSTANCE ON YOUR WEB SITE
14 COMPARE TO THE SUBSTANCE ON THE WEB ACCESSIBILITY WEB
SITE?
15 >> OKAY.
I SHALL STAY CALM.
16 (LAUGHTER).
THE INTENT MAY BE THE SAME, THAT IS GOOD,
17 ACCESSIBLE WEB SITES, BUT THEY'RE REALLY TWO
DIFFERENT ANIMALS.
18 WAI HAS WRITTEN GUIDELINES.
GUIDELINES ARE GREAT BECAUSE GUIDELINES DO NOT HAVE
19 TO BE SPECIFIC; GUIDELINES YOU CAN PICK AND CHOOSE;
AND GUIDELINES YOU CAN'T BE SUED FOR.
20 SO YOU CAN SAY WHEN AT ALL POSSIBLE, USE SIMPLEST
LANGUAGE APPROPRIATE FOR YOUR SITE.
21 WE COULDN'T POSSIBLY USE THAT.
THAT IS A WAI HIGH PRIORITY PROVISION.
22 NOW, IF WE DID THAT, WE WOULD MAKE LAWYERS RICH
BECAUSE I WOULD LOVE TO GO IN AND DEFEND SOMEBODY
23 DEBATING WHETHER OR NOT SOMEBODY ELSE HAD THE
SIMPLEST POSSIBLE LANGUAGE APPROPRIATE TO THEIR SITE.
24 I MEAN, I HIT THIS ALL THE TIME ANYWAY WITH WHENEVER
WE'RE WRITING THESE REGULATIONS, WE GET HIT WITH THIS
25 PLAIN LANGUAGE RULE THAT DRIVES ME NUTS.
THE IDEAL WOULD BE FOR WAI AND 508 TO COME TO A

48

1 COORDINATED CONSENSUS WHERE THERE WERE THREE LEVELS
OR FOUR LEVELS, I DON'T CARE HOW MANY.
2 THE FIRST LEVEL WOULD BE THE 508 BASE STANDARDS. AND
IT COULD BE THE PRIORITY ONE FOR WAI.
3 THOSE WOULD BE CLEAR AND ENFORCEABLE.
AND THEN PRIORITY 2 AND PRIORITY 3 WOULD NOT BE 508;
4 IT WOULD BE STRICTLY WAI, BUT IT WOULD BE CONSISTENT
WITH THEIR PRIORITY 1 WHICH WOULD BE IDENTICAL TO
5 OURS.
THAT WOULD BE THE IDEAL.
6 I DON'T KNOW WHETHER IT WILL HAPPEN BECAUSE THE RULE
MAKING PROCEDURE IS SO DIFFERENT FROM THE WAY WAI
7 CREATES THEIR STANDARDS.
WE DISCUSSED IT AND IT'S GOING TO TAKE A LOT OF
8 MOVEMENT ON BOTH SIDES AND UNFORTUNATELY IN THE RULE
MAKING, WE DON'T HAVE MUCH WIGGLE ROOM.
9 WAI MAKES UP THEIR OWN RULES AND THEIR OWN PROCEDURES
AND SO WE'RE KIND OF HOPING THAT MAYBE THEY WILL GET
10 A LITTLE BIT MORE FLEXIBLE AND BE WILLING TO WORK
WITH US.
11 WE CERTAINLY WOULD LIKE TO WORK WITH THEM.
>> THIS IS A VERY GOOD QUESTION.
12 TOO BAD WE HAVE TO MUDDY IT UP WITH PHOTOGRAPHS
BECAUSE IT DOES MAKE IT A LITTLE STICKIER.
13 BUT YOU MIND IF I CHANGE THIS SLIGHTLY AND TELL ME IF
THIS IS STILL CONSISTENT WITH WHAT YOU'RE ASKING.
14 I HAVE A WEB SITE UP, I'M A FEDERAL UNIVERSITY.
IS THERE SUCH A THING?
15 AND I PUT UP MY CLASS SCHEDULE IN AUGUST.
HAVE I CHANGED MY SITE?
16 DO I SUDDENLY HAVE TO RETROFIT MY SITE BECAUSE I PUT
UP THE CLASS SCHEDULE?
17 IS THAT THE SAME SORT OF THING?
YEAH.
18 SOMEBODY ASKED ME, WELL, IF WE CHANGE THE CALENDAR,
IS THAT A MAJOR RENOVATION?
19 IN DISCUSSING THIS WITH OTHERS AT THE BOARD, BECAUSE
SOMETIMES I DON'T LIKE TO STAND OUT ON A LIMB ALL
20 ALONE; IT DOES GET CHILE.
SO THIS ONE I RAN BY MY BOSS WHO'S MUCH STRONGER IN
21 THE ADA.
AND WE REALLY CAME UP WITH WHAT I THINK MAKES A LOT
22 OF SENSE AND IT IS HINGED ON THE CONCEPT OF EITHER
NEW CONSTRUCTION OR MAJOR RENOVATION FOR BUILDINGS
23 THAT NEED TO BE MADE ACCESSIBLE UNDER THE ADA.
IF YOU HAVE A HOTEL AND YOU REWALL PAPER THE LOBBY
24 THAT, IS NOT AN OPPORTUNITY TO PUT IN RAMPS AND SO
ON.
25 HOWEVER, IF YOU DECIDE IT'S TIME TO CHANGE THE DOOR
OF YOUR HOTEL, BUILD A NEW PORTAL OR WHATEVER, THAT

49

1 WOULD BE DIFFERENT BECAUSE YOU'RE CHANGING THE USE OF
IT, NOT THE LOOK OF IT.
2 AND WHEN YOU CHANGE THE USE OR THE WAY A PERSON
INTERACTS WITH YOUR WEB SITE, THAT'S WHEN THE 508 --
3 HERE'S A NICE POSITIVE SPIN: THAT'S WHEN YOU HAVE AN
OPPORTUNITY TO FIX IT.
4 >> IF THEY'RE ALL MOVED TOGETHER IN A
REASONABLE FASHION, CAN IT BE COVERED BY THE CAPTION?
5 IS THERE A NEED FOR CAPTION?
>> YEAH.
6 I MEAN AS LONG AS THE CAPTION IS A TEXT CAPTION AND
NOT A -- YOU KNOW, AN IMAGE CAPTION.
7 YOU CAN TO TEXT EMBEDDED IN AN IMAGE AND IT'S
UNREADABLE BECAUSE IT'S JUST PART OF THE IMAGE.
8 THIS WEEK, EVERYBODY'S ASKING THAT.
OCTOBER 1.
9 TO THE BEST OF MY KNOWLEDGE, REMEMBER THAT IT WOULD
HAVE TO BE A PRODUCT PROCURED AFTER JUNE 25 AND THEN
10 IT WOULD HAVE TO BE CONFIRMED OR WHATEVER BY
SOMEBODY.
11 THEY WOULD HAVE TO ASCERTAIN THAT THE PRODUCT WAS
INDEED PURCHASED IN AN ANTI-- HOW DO I SAY THIS?
12 IN AN ANTI-508 COMPLIANT MANNER AND THEN THEY WOULD
HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE PROCEDURE OF FILING A
13 COMPLAINT.
THERE JUST HASN'T BEEN TIME YET.
14 >> I HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT SELF-CONTAINED
SYSTEMS.
15 I MIGHT BE BALLPARKING BUT MEETS THE STANDARD.
: THAT USE A SCREEN READING TECHNOLOGY OR ALLOWS A
16 KEYBOARD INPUT TO INSTALL IT.
THAT WAY YOU COULD MARKET THE COPIER WITH THAT PC
17 INTERFACE LIKE THAT.
SIMPLY BY HAVING SOME SORT OF EDUCATION LIKE A AI SB
18 PORT OR A SERIAL PORT.
WOULD YOU ARGUE THAT THAT PRODUCT IN AND OF ITSELF
19 MEETS THE STANDARDS BECAUSE IT ALLOWS THAT ACCESS?
BECAUSE.
20 >> A COPIER STAYS PUT.
ONE OF THE PRIME FUNCTIONS OF A PAGER IS TO FIND YOU
21 -- WHAT IS IT, BLACK BERRIES SAY?
ACCESS ANYTIME.
22 THEY DON'T MEAN ACCESS FOR DISABILITY, THEY MEAN
ACCESS TO YOU.
23 ACCESS ANYTIME, ANYWHERE.
MEANS THIS IS A PORTABLE DEVICE.
24 TO EXPECT SOMEBODY TO CARRY A PC WITH THEM ALL THE
TIME TO RUN THAT PORTABLE DEVICE, WE'RE GETTING BACK
25 INTO THE FUNDAMENTAL ALTERATION.
YOU'VE GOT EIGHT POUNDS OF EQUIPMENT THAT YOU'RE

50

1 LUGGING AROUND TO MAKE A THREE OUNCE GIZMO
ACCESSIBLE.
2 RIGHT.
STATIONARY, YOU REALLY CAN MAKE IT REASONABLY
3 ACCESSIBLE BY ATTACHING IT ON THE NETWORK TO DRIVERS
ON THAT RUN ON THE PC.
4 YOU ARE USING IT AS A PRINTER, BUT YOU'RE USING IT AS
A FANCY PRINTER.
5 I'VE NEVER SEEN A PRINTER OUTSIDE OF A COPIER THAT
WILL STAPLE AND PUNCH HOLES AND COLLATE.
6 I THINK WE'RE OUT OF TIME?
>> WE'RE OUT OF TIME AND IF SOMEBODY WANTS
7 TO COME UP AND TALK TO ANYBODY UP HERE, WE US WANT
YOU TO KNOW THERE'S A RECEPTION IN THE EXHIBIT HALL
8 FROM 4:00 TO 6:00 TODAY.
THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME AND IF YOU HAVE OTHER
9 SESSIONS TO GO TO, OTHER WORKSHOPS TODAY AND
TOMORROW, ASK OTHER QUESTIONS.
10 (APPLAUSE)
>> I GUESS WE CAN GET STARTED.
11 ANY EVERYONE HEAR ME?
THANK YOU.
12 GOOD AFTERNOON.
WELCOME TO THE SECTION 508 WORKSHOP.
13 MY NAME IS LINDA NELSON.
I'M A PROCUREMENT ANALYST WITH THE GENERAL SERVICES
14 ADMINISTRATION OFFICE OF ACQUISITION POLICY.
I WILL BRIEFLY GIVE YOU AN OVERVIEW OF SECTION 508
15 AND THEN I WILL HAND THE WORKSHOP OVER TO ANGELENA
MOY WHO'S FROM THE DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE.
16 I HOPE THIS WORKS.
AS YOU MAY ALREADY KNOW, THERE ARE TWO REGULATIONS
17 THAT IMPLEMENT SECTION 508.
THE FIRST REGULATION, IMPLEMENTING SECTION 508, WAS
18 ISSUED BY THE ARCHITECTURAL AND TRANSPORTATION
BARRIER COMPLIANCE BOARD, BETTER KNOWN AS THE ACCESS
19 BOARD, ON DECEMBER 21, 2 TWO,IN THE FORM OF WHAT IS
KNOWN AS THE ELECTRONIC AND INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY
20 STANDARDS.
THESE STANDARDS ARE CODIFIED AT 36 CFR 1194.
21 THE SECOND REGULATION ISSUED TO IMPLEMENT SECTION 508
WAS AN AMENDMENT TO THE FAR TO ENSURE THAT AGENCY
22 ACQUISITION OF EIT COMPLIED WITH THE ACCESS BOARD'S
STANDARDS.
23 THIS AMENDMENT WAS ISSUED ON APRIL 25, 2001 AND WAS
EFFECTIVE JUNE 25, 2001.
24 ANGELENA MOY AND I BOTH WERE ON THE TEAM THAT DRAFTED
THE FINAL RULE TO AMEND THE FAR.
25 IN ADDITION TO DEVELOPING THE STANDARD, THE ACCESS
BOARD WAS ALSO TASKED WITH COMING UP WITH A

51

1 DEFINITION OF ELECTRONIC AND INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY.
THE DEFINITION IS FOUND IN THE EIT STANDARDS.
2 THE DEFINITION IS ALSO FOUND IN THE FAR IN PART
2.101.
3 THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF THE DEFINITION IS THAT EIT
INCLUDES INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY AND ANY EQUIPMENT OR
4 INTERCONNECTED SYSTEMS OR SUBSIST EMSOF EQUIPMENT
THAT IS USED IN THE CREATION, CONVERSION, OR
5 DUPLICATION OF DATA OR INFORMATION.
THIS IS IMPORTANT FOR YOU TO KNOW.
6 THE FAR ALSO REQUIRES THAT AT 39.2 TASK THE REQUIRING
OFFICE, AND THIS OFFICE IS GENERALLY THE OFFICE THAT
7 IS FUNDING AND ACQUIRING THE ELECTRONIC AND
INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY, WITH PERFORMING THE MARKET
8 RESEARCH TO DETERMINE THE AVAILABILITY OF THE
PRODUCTS AND SERVICES THAT MEET THE APPLICABLE
9 TECHNICAL PROVISIONS OF THE STANDARDS IN TIME TO MEET
THE AGENCY'S DELIVERY REQUIREMENT.
10 IF THE TECHNICAL STANDARDS ARE NOT AVAILABLE IN THE
COMMERCIAL MARKETPLACE, THEN THE REQUIRING OFFICE
11 MUST DOCUMENT IN WRITING A DESCRIPTION OF THE MARKET
RESEARCH PERFORMED AND WHICH STANDARDS THAT COULD NOT
12 BE MET IN THE MARKETPLACE.
THIS DOCUMENTATION MUST BE PROVIDED TO THE
13 CONTRACTING OFFICE ALONG WITH YOUR PURCHASE REQUEST
TO BE INCLUDED IN THE CONTRACT FILE.
14 BASED UPON THE MARKET RESEARCH THAT IS CONDUCTED, THE
REQUIRING OFFICE SHOULD DEVELOP THEIR REQUIREMENTS
15 SUCH AS SPECIFICATIONS, PRODUCT DESCRIPTIONS, AND
STATEMENT OF WORK.
16 THE FAR ALSO PROVIDES EXCEPTIONS IN WHICH 508 DOES
NOT APPLY.
17 THE FIRST EXCEPTION IS THE MICROPURCHASE EXCEPTION
THIS EXCEPTION IS FOR A ONE-TIME PURCHASE THAT TOTALS
18 $2500 OR LESS MADE ON THE OPEN MARKET AS OPPOSED TO
UNDER EXISTING CONTRACTS SUCH AS THE FEDERAL SUPPLY
19 SCHEDULE, A GOVERNMENT-WIDE ACQUISITION CONTRACT, OR
A MULTIAGENCY CONTRACT.
20 THE SECOND EXCEPTION IS THE NATIONAL SECURITY SYSTEMS
EXCEPTION.
21 THIS DEFINITION, THE DEFINITION OF NATIONAL NASHL IS
FOUND IN THE EIT STANDARDS AND THE FAR AND THIS
22 DEFINITION IS CONSISTENT WITH THE DEFINITION THAT WAS
IN CLINGER COHEN.
23 WHEN WE SPEAK OF NATIONAL NASHL SYSTEMS WE'RE TALKING
ABOUT THINGS SUCH AS A WEAPONS SYSTEM, LIKE A MISSILE
24 TRACKING SYSTEM, THINGS OF THAT NATURE.
THE THIRD EXCEPTION IS EIT THAT IS ACQUIRED BY THE
25 CONTRACTOR INCIDENTAL TO A CONTRACT.
BASICALLY IF A CONTRACTOR IS BUYING A PRODUCT FOR

52

1 THEIR OWN PERFORMANCE OR INTERN USE IN PERFORMING A
CONTRACT, IT IS NOT REQUIRED TO COMPLY WITH THE
2 STANDARDS.
ANOTHER EXCEPTION IS THE T OFFICE EXCEPTION.
3 THE BACK OFFICE EQUIPMENT ARE PRODUCTS LOCATED IN
SPACES FREQUENTED ONLY BY SERVICE PERSONNEL FOR
4 MAINTENANCE, REPAIR, OR OCCASIONAL MONITORING OF
EQUIPMENT SUCH AS TELECOM SWITCHES AS AN EXAMPLE.
5 AND THE FINAL EXCEPTION IS UNDUE BURDEN.
UNDUE BURDEN IS DEFINED AS A SIGNIFICANT DIFFICULTY
6 OR EXPENSE.
AND IN DETERMINING A SIGNIFICANT DIFFICULTY OR
7 EXPENSE, AN AGENCY MAY WANT TO CONSIDER AVAILABLE
RESOURCES.
8 AN UNDUE BURDEN REQUIRES OFFICIAL DOCUMENTATION BY
THE REQUIRING OFFICIAL.
9 BY ACCESSIBLE IS A DATA BASE THAT YOU CAN USE TO DO
MARKET RESEARCH.
10 BUY ACCESSIBLE CAN BE FOUND AT THE SECTION 508.GOV
WEB SITE GSA SPONSORS THE PORTAL THAT PROVIDES ACCESS
11 TO THE BUY ACCESSIBLE DATA BASE.
BUY ACCESSIBLE IS A PARTNERSHIP BETWEEN THE
12 GOVERNMENT AND INDUSTRY TO PROVIDE A MEANS TO ASSIST
THE GOVERNMENT PERSONNEL IN ONE METHOD OF MARKET
13 RESEARCH.
A TEMPLATE WAS DESIGNED AND IS SPONSORED BY THE
14 INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY INDUSTRY COUNCIL.
THIS TEMPLATE IS A VOLUNTARY TOOL CONTRACTORS CAN USE
15 TO OFFER INFORMATION REGARDING ACCESSIBILITY FEATURES
OF THEIR PRODUCTS.
16 THE TEMPLATE LIKE THE EIT STANDARDS IS DIVIDED INTO
SIX CATEGORIES OF TECHNICAL STANDARDS.
17 AS CAN YOU SEE ON THE SCREEN THEY HAVE THE SOFTWARE
APPLICATION AND OPERATING SYSTEMS, WEB-BASED
18 INTERNET, AND INTERNET APPLICATIONS,
TELECOMMUNICATION PRODUCTS, VIDEO AND MULTIMEDIA
19 PRODUCTS, SELF-CONTAINED CLOSED PRODUCTS AND DESKTOP
AND PORTABLE COMPUTERS.
20 IN THE TEMPLATE CONTRACTORS ARE PROVIDED A SPACE TO
IDENTIFY THOSE FEATURES THAT SUPPORT THE
21 ACCESSIBILITY REQUIREMENTS OF STANDARDS.
THE SECTION 508 INTERAGENCY STEERING AND WORKING
22 GROUP IS COMPRISED OF AGENCIES WITH LEAD
RESPONSIBILITIES FOR THE IMPLEMENTATION OF SECTION 5
23 ON 8.
THE GROUP WAS ESTABLISHED TO FURTHER FACILITATE THE
24 EFFECTIVE IMPLEMENTATION OF SECTION 508 AND ALSO TO
PROVIDE A SINGLE FACE FAIS INDUSTRY.
25 THE GROUP DEVELOPED FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS, THEY
ALSO DEVELOPED TECHNICAL GUIDES TO 508 STANDARDS.

53

1 THE GROUP ALSO FORMED AS I SAID BEFORE A PARTNERSHIP
WITH INDUSTRY TO ASSIST GOVERNMENT PERSONNEL IN
2 IMPLEMENTATION OF SECTION 508.
THE STEERING AND WORKING GROUP ARE CURRENTLY WORKING
3 ON ON-LINE 508 TRAINING, CONTINUING TO WORK ON
OUTREACH THROUGH INDUSTRY, AND THEY ARE CURRENTLY
4 WORKING ON ADDITIONAL FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS TO
BE ADDED TO THE SECTION 5 ON 508.GOV WEB SITE I WILL
5 NOW TURN THE PRESENTATION OVER TO ANGELENA MOY.
>> WOW.
6 THAT WAS GOOD.
I DON'T KNOW IF I COULD REMEMBER ALL THAT.
7 AM I ON?
OKAY.
8 WHEN THEY ASKED LINDA AND I TO DO THIS WORKSHOP, WE
WERE SCRATCHING OUR HEAD AND SAID GEE, WHAT CAN WE
9 TELL EVERYBODY?
EVERYTHING WE KNOW ABOUT SECTION 508 WE WROTE IN THE
10 FINAL RULE; WHAT ELSE CAN WE SHARE WITH YOU GUYS? SO
WE SCRATCH OUR HEAD AND THOUGHT GEE, IT'S LATE IN THE
11 AFTERNOON, MAYBE WE CAN DO SOMETHING KIND OF FUN.
SO THIS IS THE INTERACTIVE PORTION OF THE SEMINAR.
12 HOW MANY OF YOU ARE FROM PROCUREMENT OR WORK IN
PROCUREMENT?
13 OH, A FEW OF YOU.
SO YOU GUYS MAY FIND THIS BORING BECAUSE THIS --
14 WE'RE GOING TO GO THROUGH THE STEPS THAT WE WOULD
NORMALLY DO IN ANY PROCUREMENT AND YOU'LL PROBABLY
15 SAY, WELL GEE, SHE'S NOT GIVING US ANYTHING NEW.
WE DO THAT ALREADY.
16 AND THAT REALLY IS THE POINT HERE IS SECTION 508
CHANGES WHAT WE BUY; IT DOESN'T CHANGE THE WAY WE BUY
17 AND WE'RE GOING TO GO THROUGH AND SORT OF WALK
THROUGH SOME OF THE POINTS THAT LINDA BRIEFED TO YOU
18 AND MAYBE THAT'LL SINK INTO YOU GUYS MORE THAT WE
NORMALLY DO THIS.
19 WE'RE NOT DOING ANYTHING DIFFERENT.
OKAY.
20 OH, SKIPPED ONE TOO MANY.
OKAY.
21 SO WE START, WE HAVE A PROCUREMENT.
ACQUIRING OFFICE HAVE A NEED.
22 THEY IDENTIFY A NEED FOR NOTEBOOK COMPUTERS.
WHAT DO WE NORMALLY DO WHEN WE HAVE A PROCUREMENT AND
23 WE TRY TO PLAN AND TRY TO FIGURE OUT WHAT WE NEED TO
BUY.
24 WE NEED PORTABLE COMPUTERS AND WE NEED TO CONSIDER
WHAT KIND OF PROCESSOR SPEED.
25 HERE IN THIS CASE WE WANT SOMETHING'S FAIRLY FAST, WE
WANT A 750 MEGAHERTZ PROCESSOR AND WE'RE GOING TO BE

54

1 CARRYING AROUND LOTS OF REGS SO WE'RE GOING TO NEED
LOTS OF STORAGE SPACE.
2 SO A 20 GIG HARD DRIVE.
WE ARE GOING TO BE RUNNING AROUND AIRPORTLESS.
3 SO WE NEED A LIGHT WEIGHT COMPUTER.
THE LIGHTER THE BETTER.
4 WHEN WE COME TO SECTION 508, THE ACCESSIBILITY
TECHNICAL PROVISIONS, NOW OF THE SIX THAT LINDA JUST
5 WENT THROUGH WITH YOU GUYS OBVIOUSLY SINCE WE'RE NOT
BUYING SOFTWARE, WE'RE JUST BUYING COMPUTERS, THE ONE
6 THAT WOULD APPLY IS THE DESKTOP AND PORTABLE COMPUTER
STANDARDS.
7 >> THAT WAS THE CASE IF YOU ARE BUYING
SOFTWARE WITH IT, THEN YOU WOULD OBVIOUSLY LOOK AT
8 THE SOFTWARE.
HERE IN THIS CASE BECAUSE WE'RE GOING THROUGH AN
9 EXERCISE I JUST ABBREVIATED AND SAID THAT'S JUST WHAT
WE'RE BUYING.
10 JUST COMPUTERS.
THAT'S ALL RIGHT.
11 I SHOULD EMPHASIZE, THIS IS AN INTERACTIVE, TO MAKE
THIS WORK, IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS AND YOU HAVE
12 COMMENTS, FEEL FREE TO JUMP IN AT ANY TIME.
RAISE YOUR HAND IF I DON'T RECOGNIZE YOU.
13 I TRY TO SCAN THE ROOM TOW MAKE SURE THAT I'M NOT
LOSING ANYBODY, BUT YOU KNOW, RAISE YOUR HAND IF I'M
14 PASSING YOU BY.
AND AS LINDA KNOW, I LOSE MY TRAIN OF THOUGHT FAIRLY
15 QUICKLY.
SO IF I LOOK AT YOU BLANKLY BECAUSE I LOST MY TRAIN
16 OF THOUGHT...
(LAUGHTER) WE'RE ALL GETTING OLD.
17 OKAY.
ONCE WE HAVE ASCERTAINED THE BASIC REQUIREMENTS, WE
18 WILL PROCEED TO DO A MARKET RESEARCH.
AND I'VE LISTED HERE SOME OF THE NORMAL AND PEOPLE IN
19 PROCUREMENT KNOW THIS, TO DO MARKET RESEARCH, YOU
LOOK AT SOME OF THE THINGS -- OBVIOUSLY IF YOU JUST
20 DID RESEARCH ON THE SAME PRODUCT YOU'LL LOOK AT THAT,
YOU'LL LOOK AT ANY PRODUCT LITERATURE THAT YOU MIGHT
21 HAVE AND CERTAINLY THE MANUFACTURER'S WEB SITE AND
ANY TRADE JOURNALS AND MAGAZINES AND OF COURSE SINCE
22 WE'RE HERE IN 508, THE THING THAT WILL MAKE OUR JOB
EASIER IS TO GO TO THE BUY ACCESSIBLE DATA BASE AND
23 TO SEE THE THING THAT YOU'RE BUYING, THE PRODUCT THAT
YOU'RE BUYING IF THERE'S ANY LISTING IN THE DATA
24 BASE, AND RIGHT NOW WE DON'T HAVE A LOT OF LISTS IN
THE DATA BASE, BUT DO WE HAVE ANY MANUFACTURERS IN
25 HERE?
OKAY, GREAT.

55

1 AND I DON'T KNOW WHERE YOU'RE FROM, BUT FOR ALL THOSE
MANUFACTURERS THAT'S POSTED THEIR PRODUCTS, THANK
2 YOU.
BECAUSE THAT MAKES THE PROCUREMENT'S JOB SO MUCH
3 EASIER.
WHAT COMPANY ARE YOU FROM, INCIDENTALLY?
4 A. I WORK FOR PIT NEE BOWS AND I JUST LEARNED
ABOUT YOUR DATA BASE TODAY.
5 >> OH, GREAT.
>> WE HAVE A COPIER SYSTEM.
6 >> BECAUSE IN OUR EXERCISE WE USE NAMES SO
WE JUST DON'T WANT TO BE USING THAT COMPANY THAT --
7 AND YOU HAPPEN TO BE THE REP AND YOU JUMP UP AND SAID
WRONG WRONG WRONG, WE DIDN'T DO THAT.
8 BUT CERTAINLY IF YOU ARE NOT IN THE DATA BASE NOW WE
CERTAINLY ENCOURAGE YOU TO PARTICIPATE AND JOIN AND
9 PUT UP -- CERTAINLY ASSIGN PRODUCTS TO MEET THE
STANDARD AND THEN INCLUDE YOURSELF IN THE DATA BASE
10 SO OUR PEOPLE CAN FIND IT.
OKAY, NOW THAT WEAVE DECIDED THE TECHNICAL PROVISIONS
11 WE'LL USE IS DESKTOP AND PORTABLE COMPUTERS, WE WOULD
GO IN AND LOOK AND THE VERY FIRST ONE, THERE'S FOUR
12 OF THEM, AND DESKTOP PORTABLE COMPUTER LITTLES, THE
VERY FIRST ONE IS A, AND A SAYS ALL MECHANICALLY
13 OPERATED CONTROLS AND KEYS SHALL COMPLY WITH
SUBSECTION 1194.23 K 1 THROUGH 4.
14 SO WE GO TO K1 AND SEE SEE THAT IT SAYS CONTROLS AND
KEYS SHALL BE TACTILELY DISCERNIBLE WITHOUT
15 CONTRACTING THE KEYS.
WHAT DO YOU ALL THINK THAT MEANS?
16 >> RIGHT.
AND LET'S SEE WHAT THE MANUFACTURER, HOW THEY
17 ANSWERED THAT QUESTION AND WHAT THEY THINK IT MEANS.
SO YOU'RE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT.
18 THIS IS ACTUALLY A RESPONSE FROM DELL COMPUTER LISTED
IN THE WEB SITE WE JUST WENT TO THE BUY ACCESSIBLE
19 DATA BASE AND PULLED THE RESPONSE FROM THE WEB SITE.
AND IT SAYS STANDARDS FOR ALL KEYBOARDS.
20 KNOBS ON THE J, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS THE LAST
POINT, MAYBE SOMEBODY THAT'S MORE FAMILIAR WITH THAT,
21 BUT IT ANSWERS THE QUESTIONS, THE MARKS ON THE J AND
5 AND F KEY.
22 THAT'S GOOD.
AND THE NEXT -- OOPS.
23 WE HAVE THE SAME ANSWERING THE SAME CRITERIA FROM
COMPAQ.
24 IT SAYS CONTROLS, KEYS AND LATCHES ARE TACTILELY
DISCERNIBLE WITHOUT CONTROLS OR KEYS.
25 ALWAYS GOOD TO REPEAT THE QUESTIONS.
THE F AND J KEYS ON THE KEYBOARD HAVE RAISED MARKS.

56

1 AULSZ GOOD.
CONTROLS AND DRIVES ARE LOCATED ON FRONT OF THE
2 SYSTEM FORACY ACCESS.
EJECT BUTTON FOR REMOVABLE STORAGE PROTRUDE BEYOND
3 THE SYSTEM CABINET SPECIFICALLY TO PROVIDE CLEARANCE.
THAT'S ALMOST MORE INFORMATION THAN WE NEED, BUT IT
4 CERTAINLY ANSWERS THE QUESTIONS.
I ALMOST FEEL THIS IS A COMMERCIAL FOR COMPAQ.
5 >> QUESTION, WILL MULTIPLE MODELS FROM ONE
OF THESE MANUFACTURERS, AND I KNOW FOR CERTAIN THESE
6 COMPANIES HAVE MORE THAN ONE MODEL DESKTOP OR ONE
MODEL NOTEBOOK.
7 ARE THEY -- IS WHAT THEY SAY IN THIS DATA BASE APPLY
FOR EVERY MODEL OR A GIVEN MODEL?
8 >> WELL, BECAUSE I JUST LOOKED IN COMPAQ,
THEY ACTUALLY LIST SEPARATELY.
9 THEY HAVE THE TWO LINES OF LAPTOPS, THE LATITUDE, AND
THEN SPI RON OR SOMETHING.
10 AND THEY ACTUALLY HAVE A SEPARATE LISTING FOR EACH.
AND HEWLETT-PACKARD ACTUALLY HAS ACTUALLY A VERY
11 EXTENSIVE LISTING FOR EACH OF THE PRODUCTS THEY HAVE.
SO THERE IS NO -- BECAUSE THIS IS RUN BY THE
12 MANUFACTURERS, THERE IS NO STANDARDIZATION.
WE DON'T REALLY TELL THEM WHAT THEY SHOULD DO, BUT
13 IT'S A MARKETING TOOL.
SO YOU CAN SEE,... OKAY.
14 >> DELL HAS ONE SPREADSHEET THAT APPLIES
TO EVERYTHING.
15 THAT'S WHAT WE FOUND.
>> SO THE COMPLIANCE OR THE DEGREE TO
16 WHICH THEY ANSWER THE QUESTIONS AND HOW THEIR PRODUCT
AND WHAT FEATURE COMPLIES WITH WHICH STANDARDS, WHEN
17 THAT VARIES WITH MANUFACTURERS.
>> BUT IT ALSO COULD VARY WITHIN A MODEL.
18 THAT'S WHY I'M CONCERNED.
IT COULD VARY BETWEEN AN SPIRAL OR THE LATITUDE OR
19 SOMEBODY ELSE'S MODELS ARE.
THAT'S MY QUESTION,.
20 >> YEAH.
I CAN UNDERSTAND THAT, AND CERTAINLY FROM THE POINT
21 OF VIEW OF THE BUYER, THE MORE SPECIFIC THE
INFORMATION THAT'S PROVIDED THE BETTER WE CAN MAKE
22 OUR DECISIONS.
AND SO FOR THE PEOPLE IN HERE WHO ARE FROM
23 MANUFACTURERS, THAT'S CERTAINLY A POINT TO REMEMBER
THAT THIS IS A MARKETING TOOL.
24 YOU WANTED THAT INFORMATION OUT THERE FOR THE BUYER
SO WE COULD USE IT TO MAKE DECISIONS.
25 SO THE BETTER, THE MORE DETAILED INFORMATION YOU
PROVIDE, THE BETTER WE COULD USE THAT INFORMATION TO

57

1 MAKE DECISIONS.
>> THE GSA WEB SITE AND IT'S THE BUY
2 ACCESSIBLE, IS GSA CERTIFYING THAT --
>> NO.
3 THIS IS -- WE'RE JUST A PORTAL.
THIS WAS DEVELOPED AND SPONSORED BY THE INFORMATION
4 TECHNOLOGY COUNCIL.
GSA DID NOT DO THIS . WE'RE JUST A PORTAL FOR IT.
5 >> SO IN OTHER WORDS, THERE'S NO ONE FROM
GSA CAN CERTIFY WHAT THESE VENDORS ARE SAYING?
6 >> NO.
THE VENDORS DO NOT DETERMINE COMPLIANCE; THE AGENCY
7 DOES.
>> I GUESS ALL ITEMS BEING EQUAL, IF YOU
8 WERE GOING TO LOOK AT SOME SORT OF -- IF YOU SAY THAT
STANDARD BY USING THE SPEAKER, HOW ARE WE THE ONES
9 THAT THE RATE HOW WELL THEY ACTUALLY DO THIS FEATURE,
IS THAT SOME KIND OF RATING CHART, IS THERE GOING TO
10 BE A TESTING COMPONENT FOR THE INFORMATION THEY'RE
PUTTING OUT ON THE WEB SITE TO KIND OF HELP US MAKE A
11 DECISION BETWEEN SYSTEM AN AND SYSTEM B WHEN THEY
BOTH MEET THIS PARTICULAR STANDARD?
12 >> IF I UNDERSTAND YOUR QUESTION
CORRECTLY, YOU'RE ASKING IF GSA WILL TAKE ON THE ROLE
13 OF CERTIFIER, AND I BELIEVE AND PRETTY CERTAIN THE
ANSWER IS NO, THAT GSAN IS NOT TAKING ON THAT ROLE AS
14 A CERTIFICATION OFFICIAL.
>> IS GSA TO IN FACT BE THEIR FEEDBACK
15 INTO THE SYSTEM REGARDING THOSE PROJECTS THAT THEY
HAVE PURCHASED.
16 FOR INSTANCE, SPEIERON.
IF I BOUGHT THAT SPEIERON AND I FOUND THAT IN FACT
17 THAT FEATURE DID NOT WORK WELL, COULD I FEED MY
INFORMATION THERE SINCE YOU ARE ALLOWING THESE
18 COMPANIES TO MARKET TOUS, DO WE NOW GET AN
OPPORTUNITY TO SAY HOW THEIR PRODUCTS DID NOT MEET
19 THE REQUIREMENT?
>> CERTAINLY DAVE IN THE T WHO IS HIDING
20 ARE MEMBERS OF THIS INTERAGENCY GROUP, AND WE
CERTAINLY COULD BRING THAT TO TERRY AND THE PROBLEM
21 HERE IS THAT WE HAVE A LOT OF DISCUSSION ABOUT THIS
WEB SITE THIS IS VOLUNTARY INFORMATION FROM THE
22 MANUFACTURERS.
MOST MANUFACTURERS DO NOT WANT TO BE IN THE POSITION
23 TO CERTIFY TO COMPLIANCE.
THEY WANT TO TELL YOU THAT THIS IS THE FEATURES THAT
24 WE HAVE THAT WILL MEET YOUR STANDARD BUT YOU GET TO
DETERMINE AS WITH WHEN WE GO OUT AND BUY ALL THE
25 THINGS THAT WE BUY, WE DON'T LET THE CONTRACTOR TELL
US IF HE MEETS OUR REQUIREMENTS.

58

1 HE CAN CERTAINLY TELL US, BUT HE CAN'T MAKE THE
DECISION WHETHER OR NOT IT MEETS THE CRITERIAS AND
2 THE REQUIREMENTS THAT WE SET FORTH IN OUR RFP.
THAT IS THE FUNCTION OF PROCUREMENT AND REQUIREMENTS
3 PEOPLE.
>> GOVERNMENT AGENCIES, SO IN FACT THEY
4 WOULD FALL INTO THE --
>> YOU'RE LOOKING AT SOMETHING LIKE A PAST
5 PERFORMANCE, WE HAVE A PAST PERFORMANCE DATA BASE
MORE TOWARDS SERVICE CONTRACTORS.
6 WE CERTAINLY LOOK FOR TO YOU SHARE SOMETHING WITH US.
BUT THINKING OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD, THE ONE OF THE
7 PROBLEMS WOULD BE IS THAT INFORMATION GOING INTO THE
DATA BASE IS ONLY AS GOOD AS THE PEOPLE FEEDING IT.
8 SOMEBODY FROM AGENCY X DECIDED THAT THIS DOESN'T WORK
FOR ME.
9 BUT WITHOUT KNOWING SPECIFICALLY WHAT THEY MIGHT HAVE
USED THAT ITEM FOR, HOW USEFUL IS THAT INFORMATION?
10 DO I HAVE THE BACKGROUND FOR ASSESSING THE VALIDITY
OF THE INPUT.
11 THAT'S SOMETHING WE WERE LOOKING AT WHEN PUTTING
TOGETHER A PAST PERFORMANCE DATA BASE.
12 BUT HERE'S IT'S A LITTLE EASIER.
IT'S A DEFINED STANDARD.
13 >> YOU HAVE TO BE REALLY REALLY CAREFUL IF
YOU'RE GOING TO BASE THAT FEEDBACK ON ONE PERSON WITH
14 A DISABILITY.
PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES IT'S DIFFERENT.
15 IT'S ON A CASE BY CASE BASIS.
IF YOU'RE ANYTHING TO START THE PERFORMANCE OF THE
16 PRODUCT BASED ON ONE PERSON'S LEVEL OF PERFORMANCE
THAT MAY NOT WORK FOR HIM OR HER IN THE NEXT FEW
17 WEEKS AND YOU HAVE TO GO BACK AND GET ANOTHER
PRODUCT.
18 BUT IT DOESN'T MEAN THAT THAT PRODUCT IS GOING TO
FAIL FOR EVERY PERSON THAT TRIES IT.
19 PLEASE BE CAREFUL AND NOT BASE YOUR ASSESSMENTS ON
ONE OR TWO INDIVIDUALS.
20 IT'S A CASE BY CASE BASIS.
ONE INCH OF MOVING AING TOEL SWITCHER OR SOMETHING
21 LIKE THAT, ONE INCH IS A LOT.
IT'S A CASE BY CASE BASIS.
22 YOU GOTTA REMEMBER THAT.
>> AS I SAID, THAT'S ONE OF OUR CONCERNS,
23 NOT SPECIFICALLY WITH THIS BUT IN COMING UP WITH A
PAST PERFORMANCE DATA BASE IN DOD.
24 THAT'S SOME OF THE QUESTIONS WE GRAPPLE WITH.
WHEN YOU HAVE ONE CONTRACTING OFFICER MAKING AN
25 ASSESSMENT, WHAT ARE THE OBJECTIVE CRITERIA WE CAN
USE TO MAKE SURE WHAT WE'RE00 II WOULD THINK IF YOU

59

1 JUST SHARE WHAT THE EXPERIENCE HAD BEEN THOSE WHO ARE
READING AND LOOKING AT THAT FEEDBACK WOULD BE ABLE TO
2 MAKE A JUDGMENT CALL ON WHAT YOU PUT THERE IF YOU PUT
YOUR CREDENTIALS THERE THE SAME AS YOU WERE DOING IF
3 YOU WERE LOOKING AT A VENDOR TALKING ABOUT HIS
PROGRESS.
4 AND THAT TOO IS A CASE KAIS CASE APPLICATION
DEPENDING ON THE PRODUCT.
5 >> AND I THINK THAT'S THE KEY THERE.
IT'S A JUDGMENT CALL THAT YOU HAVE TO DO FOLLOW-UP,
6 YOU MAY NEED TO --.
>> EITHER WAY IT'S A JUDGMENT CALL.
7 >> I SEE THAT IN TRYING TO HELP SOME OF
THESE MANUFACTURERS IMPROVE ABOUT THEIR PRODUCTS, IF
8 IN FACT THEY DO NOT HAVE THE TEST MARKET OF DISABLED
PEOPLE TO JUDGE THEIR PRODUCTS, THEN WHERE WOULD THEY
9 GET THEM FROM IF WE IN FACT DON'T HELP THEM?
THAT'S WHAT I FOUND, IT TAKES SOME PERSPECTIVE TO BE
10 ABLE TO PUT TOGETHER A DIVERSE MARKET OF DISABLED
PEOPLE WHO ARE -- OR JUST PEOPLE PERIOD TO BE ABLE TO
11 JUDGE THEIR PROGRESS.
THEY FOR SOME REASON HAVE DECIDED THAT THE PRODUCT
12 MET THE REQUIREMENT AND THEY STATED SO.
SO IF IN FACT THERE ARE SITUATIONS THAT THEY WERE NOT
13 ABLE TO TEST, MAYBE IN FACT THEY GIVE BENEFIT BY
HAVING THE BENEFIT OF THAT INFORMATION.
14 THAT'S REALLY THE PERSPECTIVE THAT I SEE.
>> WE'LL CERTAINLY BRING THAT BACK TO THE
15 GROUP AND SEE IF IT'S A FEASIBLE THING TO DO.
I MEAN THE WAY THE DATA BASE IS SET UP NOW IS THREE
16 COLUMNS WHERE YOU HAVE -- YOU CHECK WHETHER IT MEETS
THE -- WHETHER THE CONTRACTOR OR THE MANUFACTURER
17 FELT THAT IT MET THE STANDARD AND THEY CHECKED AND
THERE'S ALSO A COLUMN WHERE THEY COULD PROVIDE A
18 SPECIFIC REMARKS AND THE THINGS THAT WE'RE READING
YOU IS FROM THE REMARKS SECTION.
19 IT'S NOT THAT THEY JUST CHECKD THAT THEY MET THE
STANDARDS.
20 THE ACTUAL VERBIAGE WHERE THEY TELL YOU HOW THEY MET
THE STANDARD OR HOW THEY MET THE PROVISION.
21 DAVID TELLS ME I HAVE TO BE VERY CAREFUL THAT THESE
ARE PROVISIONS WITHIN THE STANDARD.
22 SO IN CASE I MISSPEAK AGAIN, WHEN I SAY STANDARDS, I
MEANT THE PROVISIONS OF THE STANDARD.
23 >> GOING TO GO AHEAD AND PUT OUT A
STANDARDIZED WAY OF TESTING TO MAKE SURE THAT THESE
24 STANDARDS ARE MET?
SO THAT WHEN -- SO THAT YOU DON'T HAVE THE
25 SUBJECTIVE THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.
WILL THERE BE A STANDARDIZED TEST THAT THIS IS WHAT

60

1 THIS MEANS AND THIS IS HOW YOU TEST FOR IT TO MAKE
SURE A VENDOR IS COMPLIANT WITH THE STANDARD?
2 >> WE'RE CERTAINLY TALKING ABOUT DIFFERENT
WAYS OF TRYING TO GET TO -- YOU'RE LOOKING FOR SOME
3 EASY WAY THAT SOMEONE COULD PUT THE SEAL OF APPROVAL
ON A PRODUCT AND SAY --
4 >> NOT NECESSARILY OF AN EASY WAY, BUT I'M
LOOKING FOR THAT SUBJECTIVELY SOMEONE WHO IS DISABLED
5 DOING A TO ONE PERSON WOULD BE OKAY, B AND C MAY NOT
BE OKAY.
6 THERE SHOULD BE A STANDARDIZED WAY THAT THE VENDOR
SAYS I COMPLIED WITH THIS STANDARD.
7 THERE SHOULD BE A STANDARDIZED TEST THAT SAYS, OKAY,
IF YOU DO A, B, AND C, YOU MEET THE STANDARD.
8 IF YOU CAN'T MEET A, B, AND C, THEN YOU DON'T REALLY
MEET THE STANDARD.
9 >> I THINK THAT WE'RE GETTING THERE.
I BELIEVE IN OUR LAST MEETING AS RECENT AS THAT THERE
10 WAS SOME TALK ASSIGNING TO ACCESS BOARD TO TASK00
AUTOMATIC I RIGHT, DAVE?
11 I HATE TO PUT YOU ON THE SPOT, BUT I THINK YOU GUYS
ARE COMMITTED TO DOING THAT.
12 DAVE: THE ACCESS BOARD HAS ALREADY ISSUED
ITS 508 STANDARD.
13 SO WE'RE NOT COMING OUT WITH ANYTHING NEW EXCEPT
EDUCATIONAL INFORMATION ON THAT STANDARD.
14 I THINK THIS BUNDLE OF QUESTIONS ABOUT MEASUREMENT
WOULD APPROPRIATELY BE CHANNELED TO WHAT'S KNOWN AS
15 THE ACCESSIBILITY FORUM.
AND IF YOU COULD READ MORE ABOUT THAT ON THE SECTION
16 508.GOV WEB SITE IT'S HARD TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION IN
A GENERAL WAY.
17 THERE'S ABOUT 60 OR 70 PROVISIONS IN THE STANDARD,
AND SOME ARE VERY EXACTLY MEASURABLE LIKE NUMBER OF
18 INCHES IN NS OF AND SOME OF THEM ARE GENERAL.
SO IT'LL CONTINUE TO BE A CHALLENGE AS TO HOW WE
19 DETERMINE THE GENERAL STANDARDS SO I THINK IT'S AN
EVOLVING PROCESS AS TO WHAT NEW THINGS WILL COME OUT
20 TO HELP A FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.
>> I JUST WANT TO LET YOU ALL KNOW, THIS
21 IS A SYSTEMATIC THING YOU'RE GOING TO BE WORKING WITH
PROCUREMENT, WITH HR MANAGERS AND THE FRONT LINE
22 MANAGERS, AND THE PERSON THAT'S EMPLOYED.
SO WHAT MAY WORK FOR THAT PERSON IN THE FIRST STAINLS
23 OR THE LATER STAGES OF HIS OR HER DISABILITY AND THEN
YOU CHANGE.
24 SO THIS IS AN ONGOING PROCESS.
VERSUS CONDITIONS CAN CHANGE.
25 SO EQUIPMENT THEY NEED CHANGED.
SO YOU GO BACK.

61

1 PLAN TO CHECK ASSESSMENTS.
SO IT'S THIS TOTAL SO IT'S NOT JUST YOU MAY CHOOSE
2 THE RIGHT PRODUCT FOR THE PERSON AT THAT TIME.
THEY WORK JUST FINE.
3 OR IF THAT PERSON NEEDS EXTRA TRAINING OR THAT PERSON
MAY WANT TO GO BACK TO SOME PRODUCT THAT HE OR SHE IS
4 USED TO USING IN THE PAST.
WHAT'S GOING TO MAKE THE PERSON PRODUCTIVE IN HIS OR
5 HER JOB.
SO SOME WILL BE BETTER, AND SOME WILL NOT BE.
6 SO THE WHOLE SYNERGY OF WORKING WITH HR AND THE
PERSON, IT'S ALL THAT FEED BACK, IT ALL COMES BACK
7 TOGETHER.
IT'S NOT JUST YOU'RE THE PERSON YOU MAKE THE WRONG
8 DECISION.
IT'S TOTALLY SYNERGYISTIC.
9 [] I AGREE WITH THAT BUT I THINK YOU HAVE TO KEEP IN
MIND WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT 508, YOU'RE NOT
10 NECESSARILY PURCHASING FOR AN INDIVIDUAL AT THE TIME.
YOU'RE PURCHASING EQUIPMENT THAT COMPLY WITH THE
11 STANDARDS.
>> ALL RIGHT.
12 WEGIST LOOKED AT K1 SO NATURALLY THE NEXT PROVISIONS
IS K2.
13 LOOK AT K2 AND PAY ATTENTION TO THIS BECAUSE THERE'S
GOING TO BE A TEST ON THIS ONE.
14 PRODUCTS WHICH HAVE MECHANICALLY-OPERATED CONTROLS A
KEY SHALL COMPLY WITH THE FOLLOWING.
15 CONTROLS AND KEYS SHALL BE OPERABLE WITH ONE HAND AND
SHALL NOT REQUIRE TIGHT GRASPINGLY, PINCHING,
16 TWISTING OF THE RISK.
THE FORCE REQUIRED TO ACTIVATE CONTROLS AND KEYS
17 SHALL BE FIVE POUNDS MAXIMUM.
OKAY.
18 LET'S SEE WHAT DELL HAS TO SAY IN RESPONSE.
THE DELL COMPUTER RESPONSE IS, 1, CONTROLS AND KEYS
19 CAN BE OPERATED WITH FIVE POUNDS PRESSURE OR LESS.
GOOD.
20 TWO, OPENING, CLOSING, AND DOCKING AND REMOVING A
PORTABLE IS ACCOMPLISHED WITH ONE HAND OPERATION.
21 AN ACCESSORY CABLE IS AVAILABLE FOR SUPPORTING FLOPPY
DRIVE AND CD-ROM.
22 ONE AND TWO SORT OF ANSWERS THE QUESTION, AND THREE,
I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT PARTICULAR POINT WAS SUPPOSED
23 TO BE.
I'M NOT SURE ABOUT THESE ACCESSORY CABLES, BUT SEEMS
24 TO ME ONE AND TWO ANSWERS THE QUESTION HERE.
AND THAT'S FROM EARLIER WE TALK THE ABOUT JUDGMENT;
25 THAT'S PART OF THE JUDGMENT YOU HAVE INFORMATION AND
YOU CHOOSE TO USE THE INFORMATION AND DISCARD THE

62

1 PART THAT YOU DON'T NEED.
THIS IS WHAT COMPAQ HAS TO SAY: CONTROLS, KEYS, AND
2 LATCHES REQUIRE LESS THAN FIVE POUNDS OF FORCE TO
OPERABLE WITH ONE HAND AND REQUIRE NO BENDING OR FINE
3 MOTOR CONTROLS.
DISPLAY LATCH RELEASE, MULTIBAY REMOVAL, BATTERY
4 REMOVAL AND THE POWER OFF REQUIRE ONLY ONE HAND WITH
MOW SIMULTANEOUS ACTIONS.
5 FUNCTION KEY WORKS LIKE MICROSOFT KEY WHEN PRESSED
FIVE TIMES.
6 I THINK THAT'S INFORMATION YOU CAN USE TO EVALUATE
WHETHER OR NOT THIS COMPUTER CAN ACTUALLY COMPLY WITH
7 THE STANDARD PROVISION IN THIS AREA.
SO FOR THE PURPOSE OF THIS EXERCISE, LET'S SAY WE'VE
8 LOOKED AT ALL OUR TECHNICAL REQUIREMENT AND
DETERMINED THAT THERE ARE COMMERCIAL ITEMS OUT IN THE
9 MARKETPLACE THAT'S GOING TO MEET OUR NEED.
SO WE'RE GOING TO ISSUE AN RFP BASED ON THE CRITERIAS
10 THAT WE'VE SET UP, THE REQUIREMENTS FOR THESE
COMPUTERS WE'RE GOING TO BUY.
11 AND SO WE'RE GOING TO BUY A COMPUTER.
SO LET'S SAY 50 OF THEM THAT HAS A PROCESSOR SPEED OF
12 750 MEGAHERTZ, A 20 DIG HARD DRIVE, AND MEET ALL THE
TECHNICAL PROVISION AT 30 CFR SUBSECTION 119426 FOR
13 THE DESKTOPS AND PORTABLE COMPUTERS.
OKAY.
14 HERE COMES THE MOMENT OF TRUTH.
WE GET THE PROPOSALS BACK.
15 WE GET THREE PROPOSALS BACK AND ALL THREE OF THEM SAY
THAT THEY FULLY COMPLY WITH SECTION 508, THE
16 TECHNICAL PROVISIONS IN THE RFP.
ALSO AN AND B COMES BACK AND TELL US THE KIND OF
17 INFORMATION THAT WE JUST GOT FROM DELL AND COMPAQ.
DETAILED INFORMATION AS TO HOW THEY MET THE SPEC.
18 PROPOSAL C SAYS THEY FULLY COMPLY WITH NO FURTHER
INFORMATION.
19 NOW, AS A PROCUREMENT EVALUATION TEAM MEMBER, WHAT
WOULD YOU DO AT THIS POINT?
20 >> USE.
>> THAT MEANS THE STANDARD. SO ALL 3 OF
21 THEM SAID THEY MET THE STANDARD.
OKAY, SO.
22 >> IT'S MORE EVALUATION OF ONE AND TWO.
YOU WOULD CONSIDER -- I WOULD CONSIDER 3 IS NOT
23 RESPONSIVE; 1 AND 2 RESPONDING, AND THEN LOOK AT HOW
DO THEY MEET WHATEVER MY CRITERIA ARE.
24 >> OKAY.
DID EVERYBODY HEAR THAT?
25 >> I DISAGREE WITH THAT.
BECAUSE HE SAID THAT THEY WERE COMPLYING, RIGHT?

63

1 AND UNLESS YOU CAN PROVE HE ISN'T COMPLIANT AND IF
YOUR NEXT WEIGHT IS ON THE PRICE, YOU HAVE TO
2 CONSIDER THEM ANYWAY, BECAUSE YOU HAVEN'T PROVEN THAT
HE IS COMPLYING BECAUSE HE DIDN'T GIVE YOU DETAILS.
3 YOU DIDN'T ASK FOR DETAILS.
YOU SAID ARE THEY COMPLIANT.
4 AND HE SAYS HE'S COMPLIANT, HE DOESN'T HAVE TO BE ON
THE TEMPLATE -- IT'S NOT A REQUIREMENT.
5 >> IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE ON THE TEMPLATE.
SO YOU VOTE THAT WE SHOULD TAKE HIS WORD FOR IT?
6 >> DEFINITELY.
I MEAN, I WOULDN'T PROTEST.
7 FITOLD YOU I WAS COMPLIANT AND YOU TELL TURN ME DOWN
WITHOUT GIVING ME EVIDENCE THAT I'M NOT.
8 >> HOW DOES THE EVALUATION PACKAGE REQUIRE
THE OFFERORS TO COME BACK.
9 TO TELL YOU YOU'RE COMPLIANT, AND YOU STATE THAT
NONCOMPLIANT WITH THE TERMS COULD.
10 >> THE POINT WE HAVE TO TAKE AWAY FROM
HERE IS BE CAREFUL WHAT WE ASK FOR BECAUSE WE MIGHT
11 GET EXACTLY WHAT WE ASK FOR.
>> YOU NEED TO GO IN AND DO AN INSPECTION.
12 >> OKAY.
AND BECAUSE THIS IS AN EXERCISE, SO OBVIOUSLY WE ARE
13 IN TOTAL CONTROL.
(LAUGHTER) UNLIKE YOUR AVERAGE
14 PROCUREMENT.
OKAY.
15 SO -- AND THIS IN POINT OF FACT, WE ACTUALLY TOOK
THIS OUT OF AN ACTUAL SALES BROCHURE, SO WE'RE NOT
16 RIGGING THIS.
IN LOOKING WITH ANY RFP WITH ESPECIALLY HARDWARE,
17 THEY WANT TO GIVE YOU EVERY BROCHURE, EVERY SALES
MATERIALS THAT THEY HAVE TO CONVINCE YOU THAT THIS IS
18 THE RIGHT THING FOR YOU.
AND IN THIS PARTICULAR SALES BROCHURE AS WE'RE GOING
19 THROUGH TWE LOOK AT IT AND WE HIGHLIGHT THE FULL
LITTLE AREA FOR YOU TO LOOK AT AND THAT'S THE TWO
20 SPRING SLIDE LATCHES TO SECURE THE COMPUTER.
NOW, BASED ON THE FACT THE SIZE OF THIS COMPUTER AND
21 WHERE THESE LATCHES ARE LOCATED, HOW MUCH DO YOU WANT
TO BET THAT YOU CAN'T OPEN THIS COMPUTER WITH JUST
22 ONE LATCH?
OR PUNCHING ONE LATCH.
23 AND BECAUSE WE'RE NOT GOING TO JUST LOOK AT THE
BROCHURE AND CONSIDER THAT THAT'S -- MAKE A DECISION
24 BASED ON THAT, WE ACTUALLY G WENT OUT AND GOT THIS
PARTICULAR COMPUTER AND LINDA AND I BOTH PUSHED THE
25 SLIDE ONE AT A TIME TO SEE IF WE JUST PUSH ONE HAND
CAN WE OPEN THE TOP, AND GUESS WHAT, YOU CAN'T.

64

1 THERE'S NO WAY.
YOU HAVE TO USE BOTH HANDS AND YOU HAVE TO SLIDE THEM
2 SIMULTANEOUSLY TO BE ABLE TO RAISE THE LID.
>> BUT FOR THE CASE -- IN THIS CASE SINCE
3 WE FOUND THIS TO BE TRUE, NOW WE HAVE A DILEMMA, OR
THE QUESTION OR THE TEST.
4 THIS IS THE TEST.
HERE'S OUR PROPOSAL, PROPOSAL AN AT $1100 AND
5 PROPOSAL C AT A THOUSAND DOLLARS AND PROPOSAL C AT
$900.
6 >> I HAVE A QUESTION BEFORE WE ANSWER
THAT. THE COURT DETERMINED THAT YOU NEEDED BOTH HAND
7 SAID TO /*S TO OPEN THAT LATCH.
THAT RESPONSIBILITY FALL FAUL ON WHOM?
8 THE REQUESTER, THE PROCUREMENT PERSON, OR THE
MANUFACTURER?
9 WHO HAS THE RESPONSIBILITY?
ONCE THEY IDENTIFY THAT THEY MUST HAVE THE DESKTOP
10 STANDARD NUMBER WHATEVER, WHO HAS RESPONSIBILITY?
WHERE DOES IT LIE?
11 >> IT DEPENDS ON YOUR PROCUREMENT.
WITH MOST PROCUREMENT, AND I AM FAMILIAR WITH DOD
12 PROCUREMENT, WHEN WE DO AN EVALUATION, WE NORMALLY
HAVE A TEAM MADE UP OF AT LEAST THE REQUIREMENT
13 PEOPLE AND THE PROCUREMENT PERSON.
BUT IN THIS CASE IT'S A TECHNICAL REQUIREMENT, IT
14 WOULD BE SOMEONE ON THE TECHNICAL EVALUATION TEAM.
>> MY QUESTION, DID YOU DO THE MAIN TEST
15 FROM THE OTHER TWO?
>> YES.
16 AS A MATTER OF FACT WE DID.
WE DIDN'T ANTICIPATE THAT QUESTION, BUT WE DID.
17 >> BECAUSE IF YOU HAVE ONE MANUFACTURER'S
PRODUCT AND PUT IT TO THE TEST, YOU SHOULD DO THE
18 SAME WITH THE OTHER TWO, UNLESS YOU REQUIRE A LIVE
TEST DEMONSTRATION.
19 IF YOU REQUIRE A LIVE DEMONSTRATION AS PART OF YOUR
REQUIREMENT,.
20 >> IN A REAL LIFE SITUATION WE PROBABLY
WOULD HAVE SET UP A TEAM TO TAKE EACH OF THESE
21 COMPUTERS AND RUN THROUGH EACH OF THE --
>> WHO TEST ONE00 IBECAUSE THERE'S ONLY
22 LINDA AND MYSELF AND BECAUSE WE ONLY HAD THREE DAYS
TO PREPARE FOR THIS, WE ZEROED IN ON ONE CRITERIA AND
23 WE WENT AND LOOKED AT THE THREE COMPUTERS AND
INCIDENTALLY THEY'RE ALL REPRESENTED HERE, SO WE
24 BASICALLY JUST WALKED DOWN THE EXHIBIT HALL AND SAID
OH, AND THAT'S NOT AN ACCIDENT THAT PROPOSAL C IS IN
25 BLUE, BY THE WAY.
FOR ALL OF YOU WHO KNOWS.

65

1 OKAY. SO WE'LL TAKE AIL VOTE.
HOW MANY PEOPLE THINK THAT PROCUREMENT SHOULD GO TO
2 PROPOSAL AN OR OFFEROR A?
>> WHAT WAS IT?
3 OH, YEAH, THEY SAID THEY DID FEEDBACK.
>> HOW MANY PEOPLE THINK THE AWARD SHOULD
4 GO TO PROPOSAL B?
BY EURBGS:
5 Q. LET'S ASSUME JUST FOR THE SAKE OF ARGUMENT
THAT THEY'RE ALL -- RIGHT.
6 >> AND ONE STANDARD THEY HONE IN ON.
>> DOES ANYBODY THINK WE COULD AWARD TO C?
7 OH, GOOD, SO OUR JOB IS DONE.
WE CAN CONVINCE YOU THAT SECTION 508 IS A MINIMUM
8 TECHNICAL REQUIREMENT AND THEY ACTUALLY HAVE TO MEET
THE REQUIREMENT IN 508 TO BE ELIGIBLE FOR AWARD.
9 GIVE YOURSELF A HAND.
YOU PASS.
10 EACH ONE OF YOU SO YOU DON'T HAVE TO COME BACK; YOU
ALL PASSED! DO I HAVE ANY QUESTIONS?
11 ANY THOUGHTS YOU WANT TO SHARE?
>> IS IT POSSIBLE THAT SECTION 5 ON 8
12 REQUIREMENTS THAT ARE NOT IN USE?
>> I'M TOLD THERE ARE YES.
13 >> SO WHAT HAPPENS?
>> IF YOU CAN'T MEET IT, AND YOU FIND OUT
14 THAT THERE'S NO ONE OUT THERE THAT CAN MEET IT, THEN
IT'S NOT AVAILABLE.
15 THEN YOU DON'T HAVE TO INCLUDE IT IN YOUR RFP AS PART
-- WE ONLY WANT YOU TO BUY THINGS THAT ARE AVAILABLE.
16 AND IF IT'S NOT AVAILABLE OUT THERE IN THE MARKET
PLACE, WE DON'T WANT YOU TO DO THE IMPOSSIBLE.
17 YES.
THE GENTLEMAN IN THE BACK.
18 >> OKAY.
I READ STATEMENTS BEFORE.
19 GENERALLY MY AGENCY WOULD JUST PUT A BLANKET IN MUST
MEET SECTION 508, MY IMPRESSION FROM WHAT I'M SEEING
20 HERE AND WHAT I HAVE HEARD, IS WHAT REALLY SHOULD BE
DONE OR IS BETTER TO DO IS TO SEE WHAT PORTIONS OF
21 SECTION 508, PARTS OF THE STANDARD TO USE AND PUT IN
THAT IT'S THE ITEMS SHOULD MEET THOSE PORTIONS OF
22 508. IS THAT WHAT THE THINKING IS NOW?
>> ACTUALLY THAT'S NOT ONLY THE THINKING;
23 THAT'S WHAT'S IN THE REG THAT YOU HAVE TO LOOK AT THE
APPLICABLE PROVISION AND PUT THAT IN YOUR
24 REQUIREMENT.
THERE'S NO REASON FOR YOU TO PUT IN, IF YOU JUST PUT
25 IN SECTION 508 STANDARD, THE ENTIRE STANDARD APPLIES
TO THINGS THAT --

66

1 >> BUT IN A STATEMENT OF WORK, I'M WRITING
A STATEMENT OF WORK AND IT'S BEING USED AS PART OF A
2 SOLICITATION, AND IT GOES WITH THE SOLICITATION, I
DON'T BELIEVE THERE'S ANY REQUIREMENT ANYWHERE IN THE
3 FAR THAT SAYS WHAT GOES INTO A STATEMENT OF WORK.
LET'S GO BACK SO FAR.
4 >> I DON'T THINK THAT'S TRUE BECAUSE LINDA
AND I WROTE THAT FINAL --
5 >> AND PLEASE GIVE ME THE EXACT LANGUAGE
TO PUT IN THE STATEMENT OF WORK BECAUSE ANYWHERE I'VE
6 BEEN THAT QUESTION'S BEEN ASKED AND ASKED AND ASKED
AND EVERYBODY SAYS THE FAR DOESN'T TELL YOU WHAT TO
7 PUT IN THE STATEMENT OF WORK.
A. /*.
8 >> IT DOES TELL YOU TO PUT IN THE
APPLICABLE STANDARDS THOUGH.
9 SO IN THIS CASE WHEN WE'RE GOING THROUGH THIS
EXERCISE, THE VERY FIRST QUESTION THIS YOUNG LADY
10 ASKED ME IF WE'RE BUYING COMPUTERS THAT HAVE
SOFTWARE, WHY SHOULDN'T WE INCLUDE THE STANDARD FOR
11 SOFTWARE?
WELL CONVERSELY FI'M JUST BUYING SOFTWARE, THERE'S NO
12 REASON TO BRING IN THE WHOLE STANDARD THAT INVOLVES
LAPTOPS AND TELECOMMUNICATIONS AND MULTIMEDIA.
13 >> OKAY.
THEN THERE NEEDS TO BE A CLARIFICATION IN EVERYTHING
14 THAT'S BEEN PUBLISHED AND IN EVERY TRAINING SEMINAR
I'VE BEEN TO.
15 MOST OF THE ONES THAT HAVE GONE ON IN THE LAST SIX
MONTHS BECAUSE THAT'S NOT BEEN STATED BY ANYONE UNTIL
16 I'M SITTING HERE WITH YOU TWO TODAY.
>> WE HAVE VALUE ADDED IN SOME POINT HERE.
17 >> MY AGENCY, MY PERSONAL SOMEONE CALLED
ME AND SAID THEY WERE WRITING A STATEMENT OF WORK AND
18 THEY WANTED TO KNOW WHAT PART OF IT THEY COULD
INCLUDE.
19 SO I TURNED TO MY PROCUREMENT PEOPLE AND NO ONE HAD A
LOT OF ANSWERS BECAUSE IT WAS SO NEW, BUT ULTIMATELY
20 WHAT WE DID, WE HAD TO DETERMINE WHAT WERE THEY
REQUESTING THE CONTRACTS TO DO.
21 ONCE WE DETERMINED WHAT WE WERE ASKING THE
CONTRACTORS TO DO, THEY WANTED TO HAVE WEB PAGES AND
22 DOCUMENTATIONS, ET CETERA, SO I WENT TO SECTION 508
AND PICKED OUT THOSE STANDARDS THAT APPLY AND THEN00
23 IYES.
AND THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT YOU SHOULD DO BECAUSE THERE'S
24 NO REASON TO BRING IN -- WHEN WE BRING IN SOMETHING
INTO A TECHNICAL REQUIREMENT, AND THE PEOPLE
25 RESPONDING TO THE PROPOSAL ARE DOING THEIR JOB,
THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO RESPOND TO OUR REQUIREMENTS

67

1 SPECIFICALLY.
SO WE'RE GIVING THINGS THAT WE'RE NOT EVEN GOING TO
2 LOOK AT AND EVALUATE, THAT'S WASTING THEIR TIME AND
OUR TIME.
3 THAT'S NICE AND THAT'S NOT WHAT WE INTENDED.
STEPPING BACK JUST A LITTLE BIT TO YOUR PERFORMANCE,
4 WE DETERMINED WE COULDN'T PURCHASE C BUT HOW DID YOU
DETERMINE WHAT YOU DID PURCHASE?
5 >> OH, DID I ANSWER THE QUESTION?
I JUST TOLD EVERYBODY THAT YOU GUYS ALL RAISED YOUR
6 HAND FOR B AND I TOLD YOU YOU ALL PASSED.
>> BECAUSE YOU RULED OUT B, BUT WHAT DID
7 YOU DO --
>> NO NO WE RULED OUT C IRKTS I MEAN C.
8 SO WHAT DID YOU DO BETWEEN AN AND B.
>> WE WENT TO B BECAUSE IT'S CHEAPEST.
9 SO THAT'S WHY I PASSED EVERYBODY IN HERE WHO RAISED
THEIR HAND ON B.
10 AND NO ONE ELSE RAISED THEIR HAND ON ANYTHING ELSE,
SO I WAS VERY HAPPY.
11 DO I HAVE ANY MORE QUESTIONS?
OKAY.
12 MY JOB HERE IS DONE.
OH, NO, TWO MORE QUESTIONS.
13 BY EURBGS:
Q. YEAH.
14 SURE.
WE COULD DO THAT, YES.
15 DO YOU HAVE A --
>> NO.
16 THE POINT OF FACT IS NOW I'M IN POINT OF POLICY SO
I'M NOT IN PROCUREMENT ANYMORE.
17 SO I DON'T HAVE ANY REAL SOLICITATIONS.
>> HAVE YOU EVER GONE AND GOT SAMPLES OF
18 SOLICITATIONS LIKE BEEN ISSUED FROM LIKE JUNE 25 ON?
>> I'M JUST ASKING...
19 >> LINDA WORKING FOR GSA IS DEVELOPING
SOME TRAINING MATERIAL AND SHE IS ACTUALLY COLLECTING
20 SAMPLES SO THAT SHE COULD PUT IT INTO THE TRAINING.
>> THERE'S NOT MANY SAMPLES, I CAN TELL
21 YOU THAT.
>> JUST TO SEE WHAT PEOPLE ARE DOING AND
22 VERY RARELY DO I FIND SOMETHING WITH SECTION 508.
>> WHICH WOULD HELP MEANS PEOPLE ARE
23 BUYING ON EIT THEY NOT INCORPORATING 508 STANDARDS
WHERE THEY SHOULD.
24 >> HAVE YOU BEEN TO THE SECTION 508.GOV
WEB SITE AND YOU LOOKED AT OUR VOLUMINOUS 25 PAGE
25 FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS AND YOU STILL WANT MORE?
(LAUGHTER).

68

1 >> BESIDES THE TRAINING MATERIAL THAT
WE'RE DEVELOPING, I DON'T THINK WE'RE DOING MORE, BUT
2 AS DAVE SAID EARLIER, THIS IS ALL EVOLVING.
WE'RE THREE MONTHS INTO THE IMPLEMENTATION, SO AS WE
3 GET MORE EXAMPLES AND BEST PRACTICE COLLECTIONS,
WE'LL PROBABLY SHARE THAT ALSO PROBABLY IN THE
4 SECTION 508.GOV WEB SITE.
>> PERSONALLY I THINK PEOPLE ARE JUST NOT
5 FAMILIAR WITH THE STANDARDS YET.
LIKE I SAID, IT'S ALMOST BRAND-NEW.
6 IT'S JUST BEEN IMPLEMENTED IN LATE JUNE, AND THIS
INCIDENTALLY IS THE FOURTH QUARTER OF THE FISCAL YEAR
7 AND PEOPLE ARE PROBABLY MORE CONCERNED WITH JUST
GETTING PROCUREMENTS OUT AND PROBABLY A LOT OF THEM
8 HAVE SOLICITATIONS OUT ON THE STREETS ALREADY THAT
JUST CHOOSE TO PROBABLY IGNORE IT.
9 BUT THAT'S MY PERSONAL FEELING.
I DON'T KNOW THAT FOR A FACT.
10 >> I WAS JUST WONDERING00 IA LOT OF PEOPLE
ARE PROBABLY USING THE SCHEDULES SO THEREFORE YOU
11 PROBABLY WON'T SEE MUCH.
>> WOULD COMMRIEPS MATTER?
12 AND IN THE SECOND PART OF THAT QUESTION, IS WHAT
PRODUCT DID YOU ENVISION WHEN YOU -- WITH THE
13 MICROPURCHASING EXCEPTION?
>> TO ANSWER THE FIRST PART OF YOUR
14 QUESTION, IF IT'S A MICROPURCHASE, AND IT'S $2500 AS
A STAND-ALONE ONE-TIME BUY, THEN NO, IT WOULDN'T
15 APPLY.
>> SO YOU COULD BUY A NONCOMPLIANT LAPTOP?
16 >> RIGHT.
>> WHAT WAS THE PURPOSE -- I MEAN, WHY
17 WHAT WAS THE PURPOSE OF THAT?
>> AS I UNDERSTAND IT, THEY PUT THAT
18 EXCEPTION IN BECAUSE THEY RECOGNIZE THAT THERE WILL
BE A LOT OF PEOPLE USING CREDIT CARDS TO BUY THINGS
19 THAT ARE NOT -- MOST OF THESE MICROPURCHASE BUYS ARE
BUYS DONE BY THE USERS THAT ARE NOT GOING THROUGH
20 PROCUREMENT AND WE WAIVE LOTS OF OTHER PROCUREMENT
RULES, AND THIS IS JUST ONE THAT IS MUCH EASIER FOR
21 THESE ONE-TIME SMALL BUYS.
>> THOSE ARE FOR THE PURCHASERS THEMSELVES
22 NOW WITH A DISABILITY.
A. OR IT'S PURCHASED FOR SOMEONE WITH A
23 DISABILITY?
>> JUST BECAUSE IT'S EXEMPT DOESN'T MEAN
24 THAT YOU CAN'T HAVE -- YOU CAN ASK THE AGENCY TO --
IRKTS RIGHT.
25 SO ARE YOU SAYING IF SOMEONE HAS A CREDIT CARD, I
DON'T HAVE DISABILITY, I CAN BUY SOMETHING OFF THE

69

1 SHELF?
>> AND ALSO RIGHT NOW BECAUSE MOST OF THE
2 PRODUCTS OUT THERE BECAUSE THE MANUFACTURERS ARE
STILL NOT FAMILIAR ENOUGH WITH THE STANDARDS, SO
3 PRODUCTS ARE NOT LABELED AS SUCH.
SO WHEN A BUYER GOES TO STAPLES OR BEST BUY TO BUY
4 SOMETHING, YOU'RE OBVIOUSLY NOT GOING TO SPEND THE
KIND OF TIME THAT WE SPEND ON AN RFP OR A MAJOR BUY,
5 YOU'RE JUST GOING TO BE DEPENDENT ON THE BOX AND WHAT
THE SALESMAN CAN TELL YOU.
6 WE REQUIRE THAT USER WITH THE PURCHASE CARD TO COMPLY
WITH 508, HOW IS HE GOING TO DO IT WITHOUT SPENDING A
7 LOT OF TIME?
IT'S JUST NOT PRACTICAL AND REALISTIC FOR THAT PERSON
8 TO TRY TO BUY A PRODUCT IN TODAY'S ENVIRONMENT
WITHOUT DOING SOME HOME WORK.
9 >> THAT'S WHY THERE'S A SUNSET DATE ON
THAT.
10 WE FIGURED, AND I'VE HEARD THE ESTIMATE THAT WITHIN
TWO OR THREE YEARS THE WHOLE -- YEAH.
11 THIS IS THE SECTION 5 ON 8 COMPLIANCE IS NOT GOING TO
BE AN ISSUE [] BECAUSE ALL THE PRODUCTS ARE GOING TO
12 MEET, PEOPLE ARE GOING TO DESIGN THE PRODUCT IN THE
DESIGN CYCLE AND EVERYTHING WILL BE COMPLIANT SO
13 THAT'S NOT GOING TO BE AN ISSUE.
>> THEY ARE FUNCTIONAL BUT ONE MAY BE MUCH
14 BETTER THAN THE OTHER, IF THE INFEROR PRODUCT
COMPLIES WITH THE 508 AND THE BETTER PRODUCT IS
15 PARTIALLY COMPLIANT BUT IT DOESN'T MEET -- I'VE BEEN
TOLD THAT YOU CANNOT PURCHASE THE ONE THAT'S NOT
16 FULLY COMPLIANT, YOU HAVE TO -- THEY MAY NOT BE AS
GOOD A PRODUCT.
17 >> MY QUESTION TO YOU IS WHAT IS YOUR
MINIMUM REQUIREMENT?
18 HOW DID YOU ARTICULATE THE MINIMUM REQUIREMENT?
>> THIS IS SOFTWARE.
19 BUT I'VE OPINION TOLD THAT PEOPLE ARE NOT SAYING --
THEY'RE SAYING IS IT 508 COMPLIANT OR NOT?
20 THEY JUST WENT YES OR NO.
ONE IS PARTIALLY COMPLIANT AND THE OTHER IS
21 COMPLIANT, YOU CAN'T GO WITH THE SUPERIOR PRODUCT.
>> YES.
22 THIS IS TRUE.
IF YOU HAVE A PRODUCT IN THE MARKET THAT'S AVAILABLE
23 TO MEET YOUR NEEDS AND YOU HAVE A COMMERCIALLY
AVAILABLE PRODUCT THAT MEETS AND COMPLIES WITH ALL
24 THE STANDARDS, YOU CANNOT THEN SAY WELL I'M NOT GOING
TO BUY THIS FOR WHATEVER REASON AND BUY A PRODUCT
25 THAT'S NONCOMPLIANT.
>> EVEN THOUGH THE ONE AREA THAT DOES NOT

70

1 COMPLY IS NOT IMPORTANT.
>> THAT GOES BACK TO WHAT WE SAID EARLIER.
2 WHEN YOU START OUT IN THE PROCUREMENT PLANNING, YOU
WERE SUPPOSED TO SELECT THE REQUIREMENTS THAT IT'S
3 APPLICABLE TO YOUR BUY.
SO IF YOU WERE BUYING DESKTOP COMPUTERS YOU WOULD NOT
4 INCLUDE THE MULTIMEDIA REQUIREMENTS, FOR EXAMPLE, SO
YOU WOULD ONLY HAVE SELECTED REQUIREMENTS OF
5 TECHNICAL PROVISIONS THAT APPLY TO YOUR PROCUREMENT.
>> BUT EVEN AFTER YOU'VE DONE THAT,.
6 >> NO, WE DO NOT MAKE -- AT LEAST I AM NOT
AWARE OF ANYWHERE ELSE -- ANYWHERE IN THE STANDARD
7 WHERE WE MAKE A VALUE JUDGMENT AS TO WHICH PROVISION
IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN THE OTHER.
8 >> IF IT APPLIES TO YOUR PROCUREMENT, YES.
>> IT HAS TO APPLY TO ALL THE PROCUREMENT.
9 YOU HAVE TO MEET ALL THE REQUIREMENTS OR IF IT'S
NONCOMPLIANT -- THE OTHER.
10 >> WELL, IF IT MEETS YOUR MINIMUM
TECHNICAL REQUIREMENTS.
11 >> OKAY.
>> SO YOU CAN'T LOOK AT THIS IN ISOLATION,
12 AND I HAVE A STORY THAT I ALWAYS TELL.
DO I HAVE ANYBODY HERE FROM DOD PROCUREMENT?
13 OKAY.
I DON'T KNOW WHERE YOU'RE FROM, BUT IN DOD WE BUY A
14 LOT OF THINGS TO STANDARDS.
SO IF I HAVE A PROCUREMENT FOR DRAB OLIVE GREEN T
15 SHIRTS AND I NEED TO BUY 6000 GROSS OF THESE T
SHIRTS, SO I ISSUE AN RFP TO BUY OLIVE GREEN 100%
16 COTTON T SHIRTS.
FIGET SOMETHING BACK THAT SAYS I HAVE A T SHIRT
17 THAT'S SO WONDERFUL, IT'S STAIN RESISTANT AND YOU
DON'T NEED TO -- IT'S PERFECT.
18 IT'S ONE PROBLEM.
IT'S HOT PINK.
19 WELL WHICH ONE OF YOU ARE GOING TO GO BACK TO THAT
GENERAL THAT HAS THE REQUIREMENT FOR THE DRAB OLIVE
20 GREEN FOR HIS TROOPS AND SAY WELL, IT DOESN'T REALLY
MATTER.
21 I HAVE SUCH A BETTER T SHIRT FOR YOU.
ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS PUT YOUR TROOPS IN HOT PINK T
22 SHIRTS.
IT'S A RIDICULOUS EXAMPLE, BUT THAT'S WHAT CONSIDER
23 SAYING.
WE WANT TO TRADE-OFF SOMETHING THAT'S A TECHNICAL
24 MINIMUM REQUIREMENT BECAUSE WE THINK THAT IT DOESN'T
REALLY MATTER.
25 THIS IS NOT THAT IMPORTANT.
WELL, IT'S IMPORTANT PARTICULARLY AS IMPORTANT TO

71

1 THAT PROCUREMENT.
THE PRESIDENT SAYS THIS IS IMPORTANT, OUR CEO
2 PRESIDENT, THE PEOPLE IN CONGRESS HAVE SAID THAT THIS
IS AN IMPORTANT REQUIREMENT.
3 BEE SERVE AS THE PLEASURE OF THE PRESIDENT AND THIS
HAS BEEN DETERMINED TO BE AN IMPORTANT CRITERIA.
4 >> OKAY.
AM I DONE?
5 >> IN THE WORKSHOP WE WENT TO BEFORE, WE
WERE TALKING ABOUT ANY EMPLOYEE WITH A DISABILITY
6 YOU'RE STILL BOUND BY SECTION 508 SO IF I'M EMPLOYED
-- I DON'T HAVE ANY EMPLOYEES WITH DISABILITIES, WHAT
7 DO I NEED TO PUT IN MY RFP OR JUST PUT A LITTLE NOTE
TO YOU THAT I DID NOT HAVE ANY -- WHAT DO I I TO
8 COVER MYSELF WITH THIS BID PROCUREMENT AND MAKE SURE
I'M STILL IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE LAW?
9 >> YOU FOLLOW THE LAW.
AND THE LAW IS 508.
10 508 APPLIES WHEN YOU'RE BUYING THE IT.
AND COMPUTERS ARE EIT SO YOU WILL PUT IN --
11 >> IT'S IMMATERIAL THAT YOU DO NOT HAVE --
>> WE JUST SPENT THE LAST FEW MINUTES OF
12 TALKING ABOUT SPECIFIC REQUIREMENTS AND I'M SAYING
I'M DOING A BLANKET PROCUREMENT OF 500 PCS AND I
13 DON'T HAVE ANY EMPLOYEES RIGHT NOW WITH DISABILITIES.
SO WHAT DO I PUT IN MY PROCUREMENT TO MAKE SURE --
14 BECAUSE THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT DON'T WANT TO GO
THROUGH THE PROCESS OF HAVING TO RETROFIT YOUR PC'S
15 SO WHAT DO YOU PUT IN THERE.
YOU MUST BE COMPLIANT WITH FUTURE -- WHAT DO I TELL
16 MY VENDOR?
>> YOU STILL HAVE TO COMPLY WITH THE BASIC
17 TECHNICAL PROVISIONS FOR COMPUTERS.
I DON'T KNOW IF YOU GUYS HAVE HEARD WHAT WAS SAID BY
18 BONNIE SAINT JOHNS THIS MORNING.
IN HER VISION SHE SAID ONE OF THE BEAUTY OF SECTION
19 508 IS THAT PERSON THAT'S DISABLED DOESN'T HAVE TO
IDENTIFY HIMSELF OR HERSELF AND SAY I NEED THIS
20 ACCOMMODATION.
THE STANDARD, IF I SEE THAT WILL BE PURCHASED ALL THE
21 COMPUTERS WILL BE ACCESSIBLE.
SO WHEN SHE COMES IN THE DOOR, SHE DOESN'T HAVE TO
22 SAY, WAIT A MINUTE, I CAN'T USE THIS COMPUTER, CAN
YOU BUY A NEW ONE JUST FOR ME.
23 EVERYTHING IN THAT WORKPLACE IS NOW ACCESSIBLE SO
SHE'LL COME IN AND SHE'LL BE ABLE TO --, THE ENTIRE
24 STANDARD FOR DESKTOP OR PC.
>> RIGHT.
25 I HAVE A QUESTION.
GSA SCHEDULE ARE EXEMPT?

72

1 >> NO.
THEY'RE NOT EXEMPT.
2 >> THEY ARE NOT.
>> WHAT HAS HAPPENED IS THEY HAVE TO
3 IDENTIFY UNDER SCHEDULE WHICH TO PROVIDE YOU WITH
INFORMATION AND WHY WHERETO FIND INFORMATION ON THEIR
4 508 T. THERE'S A AITUR OF ITEMS ON SCHEDULE.
THOSE THAT DO NOT COMPLY, SOME THAT ARE PARTIALLY
5 COMPLIANT AND IF THERE'S ANY COMPLIANT BUT IT'S UP TO
THE CONTRACTORS TO TELL THEM WHERE TO FIND
6 INFORMATION AS FAR AS ACCESSIBILITY.
>> WELL, I TRIED AND I WAS SOLD THEY'RE
7 EXEMPT.
>> THEY'RE NOT EXEMPT.
8 THEY'RE NOT EXEMPT.
>> EXCUSE ME A SECOND.
9 I'M SITTING HERE LISTENING TO THE CONVERSATION,
WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PROCUREMENT AND SPECIAL NEEDS AND
10 ACCESSIBILITY ITEMS.
BASICALLY I DON'T THINK WE'VE MADE THE DISTINCTION
11 BETWEEN SPECIAL NEEDS WHICH ARE PEOPLE THAT YOU HIRE
OR HAVE IN YOUR AGENCY THAT REQUIRE SPECIAL
12 KEYBOARDS, SPECIAL THINGS OF THAT NATURE, WHICH THE
GOVERNMENT HAS FUNDED AGENCIES LIKE CAP TECH AND
13 THOSE.
SO YOU PROCUREMENT PEOPLE WOULD NOT EVER GET INTO A
14 BUY SITUATION WHERE YOU ARE IDENTIFIED SPECIAL
EQUIPMENT FOR SPECIAL NEEDS PEOPLE.
15 A BLIND INDIVIDUAL, YOU DON'T HAVE TO PURCHASE
ANYTHING FOR THEM.
16 THAT'S WHY CAP TECH AND THESE AGENCIES WERE FUNDED SO
THAT YOU DON'T HAVE TO DO THAT.
17 THE STANDARDS IN SECTION 508 ARE ACROSS THE BOARD
STANDARDS THAT ARE SET FOR EVERY GOVERNMENT PURCHASE
18 OF PIT EQUIPMENT.
AND IT DOESN'T TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION THE PERSON
19 WITH EXTREME ARTHRITIS OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.
YOU WOULD THEN GO TO A DIFFERENT AGENCY AND BASICALLY
20 COME UP WITH SPECIAL NEEDS EQUIPMENT WHICH IS
FURNISHED AND PAID FOR BY A DIFFERENT AEJTS.
21 YOU DON'T WANT TO HAVE TO TAKE IT OUT OF YOUR OWN
FUNDS TO DO THAT, AND I DON'T THINK WE GOT THE WHOLE
22 FLAVOR OF HOW THIS THING WORKS.
SO BASICALLY SECTION 508 POLICY ITSELF COVERS BUYS
23 ACROSS ANY PIT EQUIPMENT EIT EQUIPMENT.
IT'S MINIMUM REQUIREMENTS.
24 IT'S NOT REALLY FOR REAL SPECIAL NEEDS PEOPLE.
THIS IS WHAT WE NEED TO UNDERSTAND.
25 >> I'M SURE YOU ARTICULATED THAT
PERFECTLY.

73

1 >> THANK YOU.
YOU AND THEN YOU.
2 YOU GET --
>> I APPRECIATE YOUR EFFORT.
3 I WANT TO CORRECT IT A LITTLE BIT.
THE CAP CENTER HAS BEEN GIVEN MONEY TO BE ABLE TO
4 ACQUIRE ASSISTIVE TECHNOLOGY FOR AGENCIES WHO ASK.
NOT ALL AGENCIES HAVE DONE THIS . SO YOU WANT TO FIND
5 OUT IF YOUR AGENCY PARTICIPATES IN THE CAPS
INCENTIVE.
6 YOU CAN GO BACK AND THICK OUT THE CAPS.
I'M NOT SURE OF THE URL.
7 SECTION 508.GOV, YOU'RE GOING TO FIND THAT OUT.
YOU MAY HAVE IN YOUR AGENCY A SEPARATE CONTRACT.
8 THERE IS A SDIFRPGSZ BETWEEN DESKTOPS THAT MEET THE
STANDARD VERSUS MAKING SURE THAT IT'S AVAILABLE TO
9 SOMEBODY WITH A DISABILITY WHICH IS NOT WHAT WE'RE
TALKING ABOUT.
10 SO I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT NOT EVERYBODY HAS
ACCESS TO CAP.
11 BUT A LOT OF THE PEOPLE DO.
>> OKAY.
12 >> HE WAS TALKING ABOUT IS SECTION 504.
SECTION 504 FOCUSES ON THE INDIVIDUALS.
13 SECTION 508 FOCUS ON THE EQUIPMENT.
ELECTRONIC INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY.
14 SO SECOND THING.
SECTION 504 HAS BEEN ACCOMMODATING INDIVIDUALS FOR
15 YEARS.
SECTION 508 MEANS THAT EVERY PIECE OF ELECTRONIC
16 TECHNOLOGY THAT YOU ACQUIRE HAS TO CONFORM TO THE
STANDARDS.
17 >> THAT'S GREAT.
I COULDN'T HAVE SAID THAT BETTER MYSELF.
18 THANK YOU.
>> I THINK YOU ASKED ABOUT THE
19 PRESENTATION.
TERRY INFORMED ME THAT THE WEB SITE THAT'S SHOWN BACK
20 IN THAT CORNER IS WHERE YOU WOULD BE ABLE TO FIND
THIS PRESENTATION.
21 THE PRESENTATION THAT YOU'RE SEEING HERE IS AVAILABLE
ON THAT WEB SITE.
22 IT'S TVWORLDWIDE.COM.
>> JUST THE PRESENTATION, RIGHT?
23 NOT THE WHOLE HOUR AND A HALF THAT WE WERE HERE?
>> THE WHOLE THING.
24 >> OH, MY GOD!
>> I WOULD HAVE WORE BETTER CLOTHES IF I
25 KNEW THAT.
LAUGHTER).

74

1 >> OKAY.
THAT CONCLUDES OUR PORTION OF THE WORKSHOP.
2 THANK YOU
(APPLAUSE)